SHOW TRANSCRIPT

This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

[00:00:00] Matt Stagliano: So if I’m the one that wants to be seen, I just have to make a better product. How do I make a better product?

[00:00:05] Matt Stagliano: I illuminate the guest that comes on, then people will keep coming back to my show. It sounds counterintuitive, but it’s really not. It’s all about making sure that the product that you’re delivering is the best possible product, and people get pretty bored when all you’re doing is talking about yourself over and over and over.

[00:00:29] Jeff Sieh: Hello, folks. Welcome to Creator News Live. I’m Jeff Sieh, and you’re not

[00:00:33] Kira Pogge: and I’m Kira Pogge, and this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the creator economy and so much more

[00:00:38] Jeff Sieh: have you ever wondered, the best way to interview? like, when it’s your turn to talk? Or maybe it’s you so good the other person tells you something they had never said out loud before? this might be a little bit uncomfortable. What if the thing holding your interviews, your lives, even your sales calls back is that you talk too much?

[00:00:56] Jeff Sieh: If that sounds like you, it does me a little bit, you are in the [00:01:00] right place

[00:01:00] Kira Pogge: yeah, it sounds like me a little bit too. So I’m really glad that our guest today is Matt Stagliano. He is a portrait photographer from Maine, the way life should be. He’s the host of the Generator podcast and the author of a new book called Speak Less, Get

[00:01:21] Kira Pogge: More. He’s here to teach us his framework for asking better questions, a little bit about how he leverages AI to run his one-person studio, and lessons that he’s learned from over 70 plus conversations with creatives on how to do the real work.

[00:01:26] Jeff Sieh: So sit back, clear your schedule, clear your mind, and get ready for this week’s episode of Creator News Live Awesome, awesome. It, it was a little hard to get your last name to work for the AI. Had a, had a little bit of problem with that one, but it, [00:02:00] it, it came out good in the end, so, very, very cool. Thanks again for being here, Matt. This is gonna be a fun show

[00:02:05] Matt Stagliano: thanks, Jeff. That was great. And it’s, it’s really funny, the AI got my salt and pepper right. I was really actually kind of impressed with it. It made me look better. If I could have that for my headshot, that’d be actually

[00:02:15] Jeff Sieh: Sure, I will send it on. I will send it on. So I wanna jump into it because it seems like, you’re a lot like me, that you, you’ve done a lot of things, you do a lot of things. But one of the questions I had, because, you know, you’re a portrait photographer and your, your photos are stunning, by the way. I just, was really impressed looking at your portfolio.

[00:02:32] Jeff Sieh: But, you know, many times photographers and videographers, you know, they love being behind the camera, but maybe they struggle with being in front of it a little bit. So what made you decide to kinda do that? Like, go to, you know, you have a YouTube channel, you have a podcast, a Generator podcast. So kinda tell us a little bit of the origin story behind that, because I’ve found, like, a lot of times, it’s a little s- bit of a struggle for creatives to get in front of the camera like that.

[00:02:55] Matt Stagliano: Yeah, absolutely. I think self-portraits specifically are [00:03:00] probably one of the most difficult things for photographers to do, right? We live behind the camera. We’re always searching for composition and light and, you know, figuring out what the best pose is gonna be, and all of that when we focus it back on ourselves is one of the most difficult things to do, ’cause we’re not used to looking at ourselves all the time.

[00:03:17] Matt Stagliano: So before I get into a lot of that, ’cause a lot of that parallels interviewing skills, believe it or not. But yeah, I’ve had a really long, varied career. I’ve done just about everything from running nightclubs to biotech to teaching high school physics to high tech and doing mergers and acquisitions, and then back in 2010, kind of left the entire corporate world and dove into photography and did commercial work and a lot of, product work in coverage and editorial for magazines and whatnot for a lot of years in the defense industry, and then moved my way over to portraiture, which I’ve been doing since about 2018.

[00:03:55] Matt Stagliano: And I say all of that because every one of those [00:04:00] careers helps you understand people more. By understanding people more, I’ve learned to understand myself more. So I know what it feels like to be weird and fearful in front of the camera and have all that apprehension when you’re about to get photographed, and when you turn it on yourself, you feel all of that, and then you get overwhelmed with empathy for the other person in front of the camera.

[00:04:24] Matt Stagliano: So as a photographer, I am drawing from all of my experience in seeing other people be uncomfortable, seeing how I deal with it with them, and then giving myself all that self-talk back, right? “It’s not that bad. You’re beautiful the way you are. You’re… This is exactly the moment that you’re supposed to be here.”

[00:04:41] Matt Stagliano: So in order for me to, you know, take self-portraits or do all of these different things, writing, photography, AI, I’ve got to look at what I do with other people and just reflect it back on myself. So I don’t know if that really answered your question, but that’s the whole origin [00:05:00] story and why I kind of do the things that I do today.

[00:05:03] Jeff Sieh: Hmm. I think that’s great. Kiri, I know you had a question

[00:05:05] Kira Pogge: yeah. I, you know, the, the whole book is kind of based on this PODS framework. Is that something that has been informed, like you said, by your portrait photography and all of this history? Kind of where did that come from? And can you walk us through, like, what it’s like right before you hit record with a guest and you’re doing that framework yourself?

[00:05:23] Matt Stagliano: Yeah, absolutely. So the PODS framework, right? It’s, and this is part of the marketing aspect, right? talking of interviewing, make PODS sound like podcast, right? But I was really looking at what is it that I do that makes my interviews stand out a little bit differently than other people. And I never really thought about it until I sat down and I started thinking about, all right, well, I want to write the top 10 tips for people to be better at podcasting.

[00:05:50] Matt Stagliano: And I’m writing down the questions so I don’t forget. I go circuitous around answers, but I get there eventually. So with the PODS framework, when I started [00:06:00] interviewing people, my first interview was with, the lead singer of Arrested Development. His name’s Speech. And I was in, this must have been like 1994, thereabouts, and it was a college radio station, and I was interviewing, and it was awful.

[00:06:13] Matt Stagliano: It was terrible. It was the worst interview ever. I was just like starstruck. Did you ever see, like, Chris Farley when he’s interviewing Paul McCartney and he’s like, “Oh, the Beatles, that was, that was awesome.” That’s kind of how I was at the beginning, right? So as the time went on and I did television and I did radio and I started doing photography, I realized that all of the interactions that I was having got better when I shut up and I just started listening to what people were telling me.

[00:06:44] Matt Stagliano: Just thinking about paying attention and giving them the moment So when I sat down to write the book, it really started as a pamphlet. What are 10 things that I’ve learned over the past 30 years that I can give to other people because they don’t know how to [00:07:00] do this, this, this skill of interviewing, of talking to people?

[00:07:03] Matt Stagliano: And it’s really not that hard. We’ve been talking our whole lives. But what we find is that it’s easy to have a conversation. It’s hard to build the scaffolding around it. And when we want to package it together as a content creator, we’ve got to put some guardrails in place, or else we’re just going to drift off into some nether world.

[00:07:23] Matt Stagliano: So the PODS framework stands for Preparation, Orientation, Discovery, and Sendoff. And think of it not as specific scripts that you have to follow, but as jobs for each part of the interview process. So preparation is first. That comes before you ever turn a microphone on. Researching a guest, learning about them, trying to find the things that they don’t talk about, right?

[00:07:47] Matt Stagliano: really diving deep, using your Google fu and finding all of these places where you can gather information. Once you have that information, what I do is I feed it into AI, and I get [00:08:00] back a condensed list looking for this kind of thread through all of these different things that the guest has done. The orientation part is the beginning of the podcast.

[00:08:11] Matt Stagliano: Basically what we’re doing here, right? If you start an interview and just go boom, into question one, there’s no way for the audience to kinda get to know the guest. There’s no way for the guest to warm up and build trust and build rapport with the interviewer, ’cause a lot of times, let’s face it, we’re doing this, you know, we haven’t had a chance to talk for hours and hours and hours beforehand, right?

[00:08:32] Matt Stagliano: So you’ve gotta have that orientation period. The discovery phase is like, that’s the meat of the interview. This is where you fall into a natural rhythm. The guest is giving you what you want out of this, and the audience is starting to get an emotional reaction to what the guest has said, whether that’s wonder or disappointment or, you know, excitement, whatever it is.

[00:08:59] Matt Stagliano: And then [00:09:00] the sendoff is the way to land the plane in an interview. And those last five, 10 minutes are really the most important part, because what you’re doing is you’re tying everything back up. You’re letting the g- the guest know that we’re coming in for a landing, that you’ve been listening, and that your audience is getting what they came to get.

[00:09:22] Matt Stagliano: A lot of times you listen to a podcast and they say, “Oh, we’re out of time. There’s nothing left. We gotta go. Thanks for joining us.” Right? But where’s the payoff? Where’s the emotion at the end to say, “Wow, that was amazing”? That’s what I want to have happen at the end of an interview. I don’t want people to remember my questions I want to remember the emotion and the feelings that they got from listening to this conversation

[00:09:42] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. So I wanna talk about your, I mean, you’ve been mention- the PODS is in the book. It’s a big part of the book. I think, and I’m not, I’m not blowing smoke, but for the stuff that we do, I think they should make this on Captivate. If you, you start of a c- account on Captivate, you wanna start a podcast or a live show, that you have to read this book [00:10:00] first.

[00:10:00] Jeff Sieh: I think that they won’t give you the codes. Because, this book, The Audience Is Listening by Tom Webster and, Dave Jackson’s, Profit From Your Podcast, I think those are required reading before you think about doing a podcast, and your book is right up there. I mean, it, it has such good, information.

[00:10:15] Jeff Sieh: I wish I would’ve had it before I started my show. In fact, I told Kira before the show, I’m like, “I’m a little nervous about th- interviewing an expert about interviewing, because I see so many bad things that I have done.” So, you describe, like, two ways hosts fail: over-performance, where you’re so locked into those prepared questions you miss a real moment, and then you have another one called drift, where there is no, like, spine at all.

[00:10:39] Jeff Sieh: So where do you see more? Is there one that, like, hosts kinda go to when they first get started more than the others, and, and how, how do you catch yourself doing it and fixing it?

[00:10:48] Matt Stagliano: Yeah. And just to get back to your, to your first part of that comment, which is, you know, you wish you had this, so do I. The entire book is just me… It’s a resume of everything I’ve ever screwed up, right? [00:11:00] And how to fix it. And that’s really the way that I look at it. It’s a field manual for getting better at this stuff.

[00:11:05] Matt Stagliano: Now, when it comes to over-performance versus drift, I think it really depends on where you are in your life cycle of being an interviewer. Because what I see is newer interviewers, they drift more because they don’t have the scaffolding, they don’t have a plan in place, and they’re just excited to be there with the microphone on.

[00:11:25] Matt Stagliano: And they wander, and there’s a lot of uhs and ahs, and tell me about that, and then they fall into this point where they’re talking about themselves, and then it wanders over here. That’s drift, and that’s really just inexperience and lack of preparation. What I see most, though, is the over-performance, and I see that a lot because I’m shown by my algorithm daddy all of the podcasts that it thinks I’m interested in.

[00:11:52] Matt Stagliano: So I’m seeing higher-level podcasts, and I see over-performance because the host typically [00:12:00] makes it about them, right? They want to show their intelligence, their expertise. They want to show that they’ve done the research, and they have the really smart questions, and that they’re the ones that the audience came to see, and they’re not.

[00:12:13] Matt Stagliano: So they over-perform and over-perform and over-perform. And some people can get away with that because of charisma or charm or whatnot, but when I’m listening to a podcast because I’m interested in the guest, well, I already know that Jeff hosts an amazing podcast and that his audience is all about creators.

[00:12:33] Matt Stagliano: I know his resume and pedigree. I don’t know the guests, and I want to learn about them. So if Jeff spends, you know, 58 of the 60 minutes talking, what am I gonna get from it? So as I started to, I guess, research, pay more attention to podcasts and interviews that I was watching as I was writing this book, I realized that the people that we often hold in the highest regard are the ones [00:13:00] giving us the least, and the ones that are the industry veterans, the, the Terry Gross of, you know, NPR World, they’re there after 30, 40, 50 years because they’ve mastered the skill of balancing the emotion and getting the information from the guest and keeping the questions short and just driving the conversation in a way that is interesting and unique.

[00:13:25] Matt Stagliano: And I love that. I don’t like being able to predict what the next 60 minutes is gonna sound like.

[00:13:30] Kira Pogge: Yeah, and I think this, kind of like a perfect segue in, you’re talking about, you know, speak less, get more. And in your book you say, “Silence is not your enemy.” And you have this rule about taking three beats, right? After, after a question or after the guest is finished speaking to allow them to kind of continue.

[00:13:48] Kira Pogge: and I wonder if you could talk about that a little bit more, because I feel like it’s so easy to fill silence, especially nowadays when we have… The minute we’re in an elevator or a bus or anywhere that it is silent, we pull out our phone, [00:14:00] right? So what does that look like, and was that a hard thing for you to start practicing?

[00:14:06] Kira Pogge: How do people get comfortable with that?

[00:14:07] Matt Stagliano: And right there was that silence, right? And if I’m interviewing someone, and I wanted people to hear that, right? but I wanted people to hear it because research has shown that anything more than a, a, a second and a half dramatically increases the amount of additional information that you’re going to get from your guest, right?

[00:14:32] Matt Stagliano: Because why is that? We’ve been conditioned and we’ve grown up to believe that dead air is a bad thing, right? You’ve always got all of these DJs, and they’re always filling all the space with all the words because they can’t have dead air. So when we’re faced with dead air or just silence, it’s uncomfortable.

[00:14:48] Matt Stagliano: We don’t know what to do. And what I found and what shifted for me was when I realized if I just shut my mouth once in a while and didn’t dive in to ask the [00:15:00] next question or to add my insight or show how smart I am, that the guest would give me better stuff back ’cause they were like, “Oh, maybe he’s waiting for more.

[00:15:10] Matt Stagliano: Maybe I’ll give them more.” And they start to go a little bit deeper. All of that is built on the trust and rapport that you build with your guests starting up. If you just say, “Hey, my guest is Matt Stagliano,” and then stare at the camera, right, we have nowhere to go. We have no idea what to do. So I think it’s a, it’s a useful skill, especially when you’re paying attention, you know you’re pulling on that good thread that the guest is, is going down this road, and you wanna get just a little bit more.

[00:15:37] Matt Stagliano: By just staying silent or letting it hang for a little bit often invites the guest to give you something a little bit more real, a little bit deeper, and it can take the conversation in a direction that you never expected to go

[00:15:49] Jeff Sieh: I wanna do a follow-up to that because I think it’s really important, and you mention that in the book as well, and this goes to kind of w- something we’ll maybe talk about a little bit later, but the, the, post-production after your show is [00:16:00] done. A lot of these tools, especially Descript, ’cause that’s what we edit everything in Descript now, we’re big fans of that.

[00:16:05] Jeff Sieh: With these AI tools now, there’s a really easy way to, like, remove silence, right? And it will go and it’ll cut those things out, So even for this show and even for Guy’s show, I’ll use, like, take the ums and ahs out. I mean, th- those are some really…

[00:16:16] Jeff Sieh: I mean, unless it’s right in front of a word or an edit. but if you click that easy button where you remove everything, it becomes robotic. I really love what you said because it’s, it gives the thing to breathe, and when we’re talking in a conversation, if Kira says something profound, I’m not gonna jump right into it unless I’m a jerk.

[00:16:31] Jeff Sieh: You know, I’m gonna take a beat, process, and, and th- that’s art. That’s the art of editing, I think. D- just explain a little bit more about that, because you mention that in your book as well

[00:16:41] Matt Stagliano: yeah. And it’s, editing is where you can really make or break a podcast. And I love the fact that we’re now coming back to the point where we want authenticity. We want mistakes, right? The yapping is a thing because we want to know people [00:17:00] for really who they are. So when it comes to editing in podcasts or interviews of any sort, and I’m talking different than a corporate produced marketing interview style video.

[00:17:09] Matt Stagliano: When we’re talking podcasts and interviews like this, I used to take out everything that was probably more than .4 seconds out, tighten it all up, tighten it all up, tighten it all up. And that would take me hours to go through ’cause I’m a, I’m a real stickler and I would go through Final Cut and I’d really find every gap and I’d take it out.

[00:17:29] Matt Stagliano: And I realized that it, like you said, sounded robotic and it was wasting a ton of time. So rather than doing prerecorded interviews, I shifted my entire workflow and I now go live for the majority of my interviews. Why? Because it’s live to tape, I can stream it, people can watch it as it happens. But then on the audio side, I don’t have to really edit anything.

[00:17:52] Matt Stagliano: If I keep the interview moving, and provided there are no technical glitches or someone doesn’t drop an F-bomb on a child’s podcast, [00:18:00] like things like that, right? Stuff you have to take out. I leave it as is because in that silence, in those pauses, in those moments where someone’s thinking, is an inherent beauty of the conversation, and it’s the natural rhythm that we fall into.

[00:18:16] Matt Stagliano: If I start to get really fast and not have any spaces in any of my, my sentences, that drives the interview a different way than if I’m sitting back and I’m being thoughtful and maybe I drop my register down a little bit and we talk a little bit more slowly about something more serious. I think when you’re changing the dynamics in post like that, and Opus Clips does it, Descript does it, Time Bolt does it, right?

[00:18:40] Matt Stagliano: There’s all these programs out there that can reduce the time between words. All they’re really trying to do is save you time editing. But what they’re doing is taking the soul out of the actual conversation. That’s the way that I look at it

[00:18:53] Jeff Sieh: I totally agree. and another point with, about your book that, uh, both Kira and I loved, and we talked about [00:19:00] this at the start of the show before you, before you jumped on, is there was a, a phrase that you used, and I thought, and you, and you just, you alluded to it at the start of the show. But you called it, the mindset shift between

[00:19:11] Jeff Sieh: spotlight to lantern, and I thought that was so good because we’ve all seen those shows where you can tell the host is just waiting to talk.

[00:19:19] Jeff Sieh: Like, he’s not listening. He’s read- He, he’s, he’s just ready to jump in and give his call to action and all that stuff. but I, I really resonated with the host stops being the star and starts illuminating the guest. We try to do that the best we can here, but it’s, we can always do better. And for someone whose business depends on being seen, how do you balance that by pointing the light at someone else?

[00:19:41] Matt Stagliano: Yeah, the spotlight to lantern thing was something that came through me learning about myself, right? And I think a lot of us, especially in the creator economy, we want attention. We wanna be seen, right? We wanna be famous. We want the views, we want the vanity numbers. So when we start interviewing, [00:20:00] a lot of times we wanna make it about us.

[00:20:02] Matt Stagliano: We wanna build the community and the audience because they’re here to see us. They wanna come to The Matt Stagliano Show, right? And what I realized is that the better thing that I could do is bring this lantern illumination approach to the guest rather than a spotlight on me. And the reason that works is because if I can illuminate the guest and what they’re talking about, that’s actually going to benefit me.

[00:20:30] Matt Stagliano: Because, like I mentioned earlier, the audience is going to realize, “Hey, this guy’s asking good questions. I feel something from this interview. I don’t have to be listening to what Matt says, but I know that he’s gonna make me hear something that I hadn’t heard before. He’s gonna make the guest go somewhere they haven’t gone before.”

[00:20:49] Matt Stagliano: And I’m always after that emotional reaction in a conversation rather than just the same patent information that they can get anywhere. So a lot of the, [00:21:00] the lantern concept is going to come back to me in a positive light. So if I’m the one that wants to be seen, I just have to make a better product. How do I make a better product?

[00:21:11] Matt Stagliano: I illuminate the guest that comes on, then people will keep coming back to my show. It sounds counterintuitive, but it’s really not. It’s all about making sure that the product that you’re delivering is the best possible product, and people get pretty bored when all you’re doing is talking about yourself over and over and over.

[00:21:31] Matt Stagliano: If you can keep things interesting and police the conversation in a way that keeps bringing it back to the North Star, as I call it, the point that you want people to take away from the interview, if you can tie everybody back into that, it becomes a much different style of conversation, and people will start to tell other folks, “You’ve gotta hear what he said on this.

[00:21:54] Matt Stagliano: You’ve gotta see the types of interviews that he does.” that’s the em- the emotion that I want. So [00:22:00] I had to shift from myself to glorifying other people, and that works for me

[00:22:04] Jeff Sieh: Hmm.

[00:22:04] Kira Pogge: And I feel like the, interesting part of that is it’s beautiful, like you say, it’s the North Star. If you look at that quote before you go into an interview, I think it’s such a beautiful reminder, like shine the lantern, shine the lantern. Just keep thinking of that. And I’m wondering, for those people who are listening who are podcasters or content creators that are interviewing others, can you share a little bit about the moment with Nicole York that you shared, where she talks about having anxiety attacks, and the lantern kind of goes away for a moment.

[00:22:33] Kira Pogge: You know, what did that moment teach you, and how do you recover from that? If you catch yourself in the middle of an interview going, “Ooh, I should have maybe brought that lantern back onto the guest and spent more time there,” what do we do then?

[00:22:45] Matt Stagliano: Yeah. First, I need you to get out of my head because I say, “Ooh, I shouldn’t have done that,” about 30 times every interview, right? Nicole York is probably one of the smartest people I’ve ever met. She’s an author. she writes under the name Nicole McKee, and she does [00:23:00] gaslamp fantasy stuff. She’s a prolific author, and she’s truly one of the most brilliant people I know.

[00:23:04] Matt Stagliano: And for a lot of years, it started in COVID, we ran a daily podcast for a couple of hours on Clubhouse called The Artist Forge, and there were four or five of us, and we would have these really deep discussions about creativity and philosophy every single day for years. So I got to know Nicole really well.

[00:23:22] Matt Stagliano: When COVID died down and I started Generator, which was really just an offshoot of The Artist Forge, having the same types of conversations, she came on and she was one of my first guests, and because I knew her so well, I had good information to go off of, and I think I took some of that for granted because of our relationship The moment that happened was we were talking about imposter syndrome and why so many creators, you know, carry that with them, even though they shouldn’t have it.

[00:23:51] Matt Stagliano: And we were talking about it, and I asked her, and I forget the exact question, but it was something along the lines of, “Do you have imposter, you know, imposter syndrome?” And she said, and it [00:24:00] was somewhat sly, I don’t know if it comes across in the book, but it was somewhat sly. She’s like, “No, I have anxiety attacks.”

[00:24:04] Matt Stagliano: And then, you know, I said, “Yeah, that’s funny. Okay, great. Next question.” Instead of pulling on that thread a little bit and just having some shared experience and saying, “You know what? I have anxiety attacks probably 37 times a day whenever I go to do something in front of a camera.” So why not have that discussion a little bit more with her?

[00:24:25] Matt Stagliano: Dig in there, pull on that thread a little bit. Because those are the moments that your audience is going to connect to, and it’s what changes an audience to a community, because now you have people that are relating in a different way. And we can all go out and research YouTube and watch interviews and see stuff on Google and get a good impression of someone, but when you’re hearing something that they haven’t talked about before, and in that case, Nicole was talking about her anxiety attacks, if you don’t explore that a little bit, you’re doing a disservice to your community because they’re there for that [00:25:00] type of content.

[00:25:01] Matt Stagliano: And that was the moment that I realized, ah. And it was only in hindsight. It was during the editing where I’m, I’m going through it and I go, “I missed a big moment there.” So it happens. It happens all the time to the best of us. There are times where I’m listening to Mike Rowe or, you know, Terry Gross or even Sean Evans on Hot Ones, right?

[00:25:20] Matt Stagliano: I’ll, I’ll listen and I’m like, “Ah, I wish they dug in a little bit further.” And only through repetition do you start to learn like, okay, just forget about asking the next question, listen to what’s being said, and follow that thread until the end of it, and then you can switch the topic

[00:25:37] Jeff Sieh: that’s one of the reasons I love live is because once you start doing it and have done it for a while, that you can pull in people who watch regularly, like we have. In fact, I’m gonna do it right now ’cause we have some, one of our friends who shows up almost every week, Mr. Dustin Stout, says, “Now that I think about it, on- the only podcasts I really listen to are recorded without editing, like a live stream.”

[00:25:57] Jeff Sieh: And then, we have the amazing Miss Jill [00:26:00] saying, “So happy to catch this live.” And then we have the Ecamm fam saying, “We love Matt.” Yes, so the, one of the cool things is, is, the online community, when you do a live show, you can pull up and have this immediate feedback, which is so much fun. But I was so excited to have Matt on, I forgot to talk about the sponsor of the show, which of course is Ecamm.

[00:26:20] Jeff Sieh: You can find out more about them at ecamm.com/jeff, and we actually have a word from our sponsor That’s right, the amazing folks at Ecamm, they are awesome. And by the way, they have a camp coming up next month, coming up really quickly in the Chicago area. You, it’s, uh, right before Mac Stock on July 9th. I’ll be there speaking as, as well as the amazing [00:27:00] folks at Ecamm, and just such a good roundup of people.

[00:27:03] Jeff Sieh: It’s gonna be so… I learn so much just by being there. So if you’re gonna be in the Crystal Lake Chicago area, make sure you check it out July 9th, coming up next month. We would love to see you there. You can find out more at ecamm.com/camp. All righty, one of the things I wanted to ask kind of our, audience, really quickly is that, you know, we’re gonna talk about AI and, and specifically AI for using and building a show.

[00:27:26] Jeff Sieh: So where are you guys at with AI? Are you all in? Are you dabbling with it or haven’t even started yet? So, down in the comments, wherever you’re watching from, say, “All in,” “I’m dabbling,” or “Haven’t started.” I am all in. I love it. Uh, I’m gonna nerd out with, Matt here, I’m sure, about his processes, because he alluded to a lot of it in his book, and if, if he’s anything like me, that’s always changing.

[00:27:48] Jeff Sieh: You’re always adding stuff and, and kind of tweaking the system. So let’s talk about that a little bit. When did you start, using AI? Was it mostly in your interview prep, research, all that stuff? Like, how did that kind of [00:28:00] start transforming the way you prepare for a show?

[00:28:02] Matt Stagliano: Yeah, I resisted AI for a really long time, especially in the podcast space, right? And I think I’ve been tied in with ChatGPT and Claude for a couple of years now, and I feel like it’s just part of my life, right? I’m all in on AI with the exception of generative stuff, and that’s only because it’s a, it’s a choice being a photographer, I’d rather do it with my camera.

[00:28:25] Matt Stagliano: Purely my choice, but I see the power in it, right? With, with podcasting specifically, I realized that I needed something to help me get my time back. I was spending, for one episode, I was spending upwards of 10, 12 hours a week either prepping or editing that one 45 minute to 60 minute episode, and that was just way too much time.

[00:28:48] Matt Stagliano: So how do I make it faster? And I started looking at the tools, the large language models, and realizing, you know, I’m kind of monogamous with, with Claude. He’s in some, you know, open relationship with me, but I [00:29:00] tend to be a one, one LLM type of person. And ChatGPT wasn’t giving me what I wanted. When I moved over to Claude and it seemed to have a bit more of the semantics that I liked, a bit more of a human feel, if you will, which is kind of weird to say

[00:29:15] Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

[00:29:15] Matt Stagliano: I said, “How can I use the power of this to condense all of my notes?”

[00:29:20] Matt Stagliano: Now, I wasn’t in Claude Code at the time. They didn’t have Claude Cowork at the time. I just said, “I’ve got all these links and all this information about Jeff. How do I collate it together? Is that something you can do?” And it would spit out, you know, three pages of kind of gobbledygook. And then I learned more about prompting, about how to manage the language model, how to set it up to sound like me, and in doing all that prep work, I could now use it as an employee rather than just a robot that I feed things to.

[00:29:51] Matt Stagliano: So to make a very long story sh- of trial and error very short, what it came down to was I said, “All right, I need [00:30:00] another framework,” right? Everything in my world is systems and workflows and frameworks. I need a framework that’s repeatable for me, that gives me the things that I need for my show, that give me the latitude to have the conversations that I want to have.

[00:30:14] Matt Stagliano: So the way that I use AI to build out my show is I say, “Okay.” I go out and I learn everything that I can about my guest, and I write down the links. I use, you know, Apple Notes or Notion or whatever, and I dump everything in there. And then I say, “All right, Claude, take this. I want five narrative arcs,” right?

[00:30:34] Matt Stagliano: I want an opening. I want a middle arc. I want to find this common thread that is the North Star. I want those narrative arcs to always come back to the North Star, and then I want 10 to 20 questions per narrative arc that I can ask. Then I look at that, and it spits that out. I look at that, and I cross it out, and I edit it, and I change it all up again, and I just keep refining, keep refining.

[00:30:56] Matt Stagliano: By the end of it, I have a one-sheet that I can pull [00:31:00] up at any time if I feel like the conversation is drifting off or I haven’t covered something, or it’s just a reminder that, oh yeah, I gotta ask them about muscle cars or whatever it might be I do that, then I can sit back and just have the conversation, ’cause I’ve done the preparation.

[00:31:17] Matt Stagliano: And because I’ve read it so many times and written it so many times, it’s already kind of imprinted up here in the melon. So all I have to do now is trust myself to listen for the moment and then explore that with the guest. I find that people overprepare and under-listen. They just wanna ask the most pertinent question or the most intelligent question, and they’re not listening to what’s actually happening.

[00:31:43] Matt Stagliano: And I kinda, you know, someone asked me this question before about preparing and preparing and why do you do so much prep before the interview? And I kinda likened it to Special Forces soldiers that train and train and train and train and train until everything becomes muscle memory, so that when they’re [00:32:00] faced with a situation, they have more time to just think and make good decisions and act appropriately rather than fumbling with the equipment in front of them.

[00:32:10] Matt Stagliano: So for me, I wanna do as much preparation as I can in advance so that I have more room to think and decide and act in the moment when it arrives

[00:32:20] Jeff Sieh: Totally

[00:32:21] Kira Pogge: I do think that’s what Claude is so good at, is, like, helping with that research, that, that dialing down. But when you talk about the trial and error, that’s a place I think a lot of people get stuck, and then they jump off of AI, ’cause they trial and error a couple times, it feels really overwhelming, and then they’re just like, “I don’t know how to use this thing.”

[00:32:41] Kira Pogge: So for small business owners or, or creators who are listening, can you talk about, like, where they go wrong in those first trial and error moments, that, like, first week of trying it? And share a little bit more about your product, that you have about getting good with Claude and what that really means for them

[00:32:57] Matt Stagliano: Yeah. Getting good at Claude [00:33:00] doesn’t mean you have to be a coder or a developer or even a prompt engineer. Uh, right? Is that a, is that a job, a prompt engineer? so getting good at Claude, getting good at any AI means you have to look at it a little bit differently, and I’ll, I’ll make this specifically for small business owners, but I think it applies to anybody.

[00:33:18] Matt Stagliano: You can go into AI and approach it as a tool. This is a thing that I have to learn. This is a big, scary beast. I’m not technical. I don’t have any technological skills. I’m scared of it. I can barely get into incognito mode without screwing something up. I don’t know what I’m doing. And I think we look at it that way, and we dump in the biggest, hardest possible thing we c- I want you to create an entire content system for me And we haven’t given it any parameters about who we are, so it spits out something and it’s not worth anything. Instead of treating the LLM like [00:34:00] an employee that you just hired by saying, “All right. Here’s what I’m gonna do. I know you’ve got all this intelligence, all this skill. I’m gonna give you a task, you’re gonna do it, and it’s gonna come back to me. I’ll give you feedback, and then you’re gonna try it again.”

[00:34:12] Matt Stagliano: But you don’t hire someone if they don’t know anything about your company or what it does. So you have to build that foundation within your large language model of who you are, what your business does, what it sounds like, what your goals look like, so that everything that you do from that point on, it’s got that contextual understanding of what it is that your business actually provides.

[00:34:37] Matt Stagliano: When you can frame it like that and utilize the different aspects and strengths and weaknesses of the LLM, you get much better output. Now, and here’s where it applies to small business owners, most small business owners came from a large business at one point in time. They were managed by somebody. And depending on the size of their business, they may or may not manage [00:35:00] someone now.

[00:35:00] Matt Stagliano: But those skills are transferable between the business and the employees that they have now, and talking to Claude or talking to Gemini or ChatGPT. If you treat it like an employee where you’re giving it valuable feedback, keeping it within the parameters, and driving towards the same goals that you have, now you start to get better output.

[00:35:21] Matt Stagliano: So when I’m using that for my interviews, whether I’m using it for my own marketing or as a thinking partner, I don’t look at Claude anymore as this robot that has to spit out information. I argue with it, I thank it, right? I talk to it like an employee. I’ve managed hundreds of employees in my corporate career.

[00:35:42] Matt Stagliano: The skills are no different in guiding someone to get better and grow into their position, and that’s all I’m doing, is I’m growing Claude to be a team that works underneath me with very specific instructions and a very specific set of goals catered to my voice and my business. And I think [00:36:00] that’s what people miss.

[00:36:00] Matt Stagliano: They think of it as this big, scary technology instead of looking at it as a hire that they have to train.

[00:36:07] Jeff Sieh: So I wanna pull this thread a little bit of, AI in your business, ’cause w- y- we’ve been talking in your books really about, you know, podcasting, live video, that kind of stuff. But I would … I’m really interested, too, a little tangent here, of how are you using it in your portrait photography? I mean, you mentioned not using it for generative stuff, which totally understandable, but how are you using it in your systems over in that portrait side?

[00:36:30] Matt Stagliano: So the thing that I love about AI is it gives me the chance to spend less time on the business part of work and more time with the camera in my hand, listening to the person in front of me, trying to bring out the side of them that they want the world to see, right? That’s the whole goal of this, and it’s mainly because I can’t afford to hire somebody.

[00:36:53] Matt Stagliano: So what do I use AI for? I use it to build my websites. I build in Claude Code, which [00:37:00] interfaces with WordPress and with my Captivate and with YouTube, and it collates everything together and I build all my websites. I use it to build my marketing materials, to put together podcast research, to do research on what’s trending from other creators, what’s happening.

[00:37:18] Matt Stagliano: I use it to track all of my SEO and interface. I use Ahrefs as my SEO, application. So I have an MCP server that connects directly to Ahrefs and can give me SEO reports. I’ve built out a team of agents, well, agents in Claude, that have specific goals. There is a software developer, there’s a chief of staff, there’s a, a copywriter, there’s an editor, and all of those different skills, for lack of better terms, are applied at different gates in my process.

[00:37:50] Matt Stagliano: So if I say write an email, okay, it’ll write an email, but it has to go through the copywriter, and then it has to go through the editor in chief, and then it goes to the chief of [00:38:00] staff because all of those gates need to check, does it sound like me? Is it giving correct information? And nothing ever gets sent without human approval or human eyes.

[00:38:10] Matt Stagliano: What it does, it saves me all the time of sitting down and going, “All right, Jeff wants to come in on June 19th. all right, where does he live? What does he wanna do? Let’s put together this mood board,” right? It gives me the chance to do all of that in a few minutes and then spend more time with my client, and that’s the trade-off.

[00:38:29] Matt Stagliano: I’m gonna produce the images. All the other stuff that takes up all my time as a business owner, my QuickBooks, all that, I use AI to just move through it faster. I still have to do the work, but I can move through it a lot faster

[00:38:41] Jeff Sieh: you and I need to have an offline session where we just nerd out about Claude and, and what we’re doing sometime because it, it really has changed a lot for me. It’s the same, even the show prep stuff, like something that for my Friday show, at, uh, Thursday I would, you know, spend all day getting it ready, getting the questions, really doing research.

[00:38:58] Jeff Sieh: Now it’s basically, it’s [00:39:00] sh- shrunk it to less than a half a day, but I still have the same output. I mean, it, it writes the lyrics for my songs to look at before I put them in s- I mean, all that stuff. So it, it is a game changer. But I’m really interested, you know, you’re a creative. You’re, you’re not an engineer.

[00:39:14] Jeff Sieh: Uh, you’re, you weren’t a coder. So what finally made AI click for you, and, and what’s the mindset shift that gets, like, a non-technical owner or business owner, like, over that hump?

[00:39:24] Matt Stagliano: I, I think it, you know, like I mentioned a few minutes ago, it’s, it’s changing that mindset to looking at it not as a human, because I don’t want to start to anthropomorphize something that I know is just a collection of all of us. But what I like to look at is say Do you want this AI, this la- large language model to sound like you?

[00:39:43] Matt Stagliano: Do you want it to be a thinking partner? If so, then you have to treat it in a different way than you would an application, than you would Final Cut, right? You go into Final Cut and I’m like, “All right, I got these key commands, and I gotta do these seven things.” For Claude, I use it to ask [00:40:00] it questions about things I don’t know, right?

[00:40:03] Matt Stagliano: Teach me how to do this. Hey, I… Man, it’s been a long time since I made music. There have been a lot of updates. What are people using now? Is it Logic? Is it Pro Tools? Is it Reason? Like, what are people using? And then teach me about the cycle of fifths, right? ‘Cause I forget all that theory from college. Let me learn how to do that.

[00:40:22] Matt Stagliano: People forget that you can ask questions and get results back that improve your next question. So when I’m interacting with Claude, I’m doing things out of a place of I don’t know how to do this, I need to learn more, I don’t have the time to look through all of Google to figure out how to fix my snowblower, but I can upload all of the manuals, and it can save me time by asking it the question, saying, “You’ve got all the context now.

[00:40:51] Matt Stagliano: Give me the answer.” So I think, you know, for the non-technical people, it’s removing that fear of technology [00:41:00] and just saying, “We’re gonna have a conversation with this person.” Like going out to a networking event, and you have that weird small talk at the beginning, and you kind of get the answers you’re expecting.

[00:41:09] Matt Stagliano: But the more time you spend with that person, the more you get to know them, and now you develop this kind of semantic relationship of what it can do and what it can’t do. So when people are starting to approach this, all I say is go back to that analogy of a networking meeting, a new hire, right? It’s going to take some time for the language model to learn about you the same way you’re learning about it and its capabilities.

[00:41:36] Matt Stagliano: It’s the smartest infant ever. We just have to teach it how to crawl, and then how to walk, and then how to run. And then suddenly, you know, this, this large language model is your kind of ride or die, you know? They’re just kind of hanging out with you all the time. So that’s the way that I approach it, but it’s not something where you press an easy button and it all happens overnight.

[00:41:58] Matt Stagliano: It’s something that [00:42:00] takes time. I’ve been doing this for years, and I just built an app, like a teleprompter app, just because I, I haven’t coded since my old high tech days. And I was like, “Uh, I don’t wanna spend time coding. I wanna build something that I don’t have. How quickly can I do it?” And it was a big learning experience, but it was great.

[00:42:20] Matt Stagliano: I made a ton of mistakes. The product is okay at best But I learned a lot in there about what Claude can do and what it can’t do, and how to set up repositories, and how to use Claude Code, and how to do version branches. And so the things that I’m getting from it are less about the end output and more about what are my interactions?

[00:42:40] Matt Stagliano: What do I like and don’t like? I don’t want to build an entire content system. I want to get a morning brief. What’s on my calendar today? What are the emails that I have to respond to because they’re revenue generating? Those are the things that I want my LLM to tell me without having to ask. Run [00:43:00] a chronological job and have it spit that out every morning at 7:00 AM.

[00:43:03] Matt Stagliano: So when I’m doom scrolling in bed and I get off of TikTok, I can look at, all right, I actually have to go on Jeff’s podcast today and do this,

[00:43:09] Jeff Sieh: Get up, brush your teeth, man. Come on.

[00:43:11] Matt Stagliano: There it is, right? Eventually put pants

[00:43:13] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, that’s exactly… Well, you might, I, I draw the Yeah

[00:43:16] Kira Pogge: the way you’re talking about, like, onboarding, onboarding your AI the same way you would a, an employee or getting to know someone in a networking meeting I think is a, a beautiful way to put it, and it does take some of the fear of the technology away for people who are kind of overwhelmed by all the zeros and ones, of it all.

[00:43:33] Kira Pogge: But if, if someone’s doing it for the first time and they’re listening to you and they’re super inspired by what you’ve built for your business, and he has an app that he built that to goes with his book that’s really wonderful, too, that’s really fun. I was playing with that before the call. Um,what would you tell them to do first?

[00:43:49] Kira Pogge: Like, what’s that first step they should take if they actually wanna save time in their business without kind of becoming overwhelmed by AI?

[00:43:56] Matt Stagliano: Start small is the way that I really go about it, right? [00:44:00] And, and a lot of times we say, “This is gonna save us time.” We’re all told that AI is gonna either, well, save or destroy the world. I’m somewhere in the middle, right? So for the people that say it’s gonna save the, save the world, they’re like, “Okay, great.

[00:44:12] Matt Stagliano: I’m gonna build my own version of a stream deck, which is then gonna run every application on my computer, and then I can just sit back and watch the YouTube money roll in.” It ain’t that easy. Start with writing an email that sounds like you, right? How do you do that? And you have to start small. Start looking around in your life at the little loops that cause you a ton of frustration and time.

[00:44:37] Matt Stagliano: You probably look at your phone 70 times a day looking at new texts or new emails or whatnot. Well, wouldn’t it make sense to, instead of looking at your email every five minutes, ’cause I’m gonna make people feel bad, but you’re not that important, right? When you can say, “All right, twice a day, I’m going to have Claude go into my [00:45:00] Gmail account, look at all of my email, and then at noon tell me which three are immediate responses,” right?

[00:45:08] Matt Stagliano: And if there are people that are getting mad at you outside of an emergency situation and you’re not responding within three hours, you need to rethink that relationship a little bit and set some better boundaries. So I think people need to start small with little tasks that annoy them, and thinking about, “How can I automate this?

[00:45:26] Matt Stagliano: How can I build a system around this? How can I change the parameters of this so that it doesn’t frustrate me?” We want these AI tools to give us time back in our lives so we can enjoy our friends, our relationships, our hobbies, touch grass once in a while, right? We want the ability to live a more harmonious life.

[00:45:48] Matt Stagliano: Balance is a fallacy. Harmony is really what I strive for. So if I can live a more harmonious life by utilizing these tools to save myself time [00:46:00] in little incremental ways, all of that builds up into a better lifestyle for me. So that’s what I implore that people do. Don’t try to, you know, build Rome in a day. Try to build a vase, right? Just start with a little bit of pottery. That’s the way that I go about it.

[00:46:18] Jeff Sieh: That is really great advice. and I wanted to, I wanted to pull up some of these comments we’re getting over on the stream. Megan Powers, who has a great making and marketing podcast, and she goes, we were asking about all in or dabbling with AI, and she goes, “I’m all in and dabbling.” which is great.

[00:46:35] Jeff Sieh: I mean, workflows are great, but it’s gotta work for you. Like, you can’t just say, “Oh, I’m gonna do what Matt says. I’m gonna do what Jeff, I’m gonna do what Kira says.” Like, it’s gotta be, it’s… And it’s also a living document. Like, you can change things. Like, you’re not… I tell people, “You can’t break it.” Now, you, it can delete things, but, like, you’re not gonna break the AI, so go play with it, have fun.

[00:46:53] Jeff Sieh: and it’s really interesting some things that, Dustin was saying, and Dustin, if you don’t know, he’s the founder and CEO over at [00:47:00] Magai, and Dustin says, “Here’s the thing though, ChatGPT’s models are actually more creative. There are technical reasons for this. Not to say Claude isn’t a creative, not as good at ChatGPT in the creative range.”

[00:47:09] Jeff Sieh: That’s really interesting, ’cause I’m actually, Dustin, having Claude write prompts that I take over for images over at at Chat. And I’m so… we’ll have to have a conversation about that, ’cause I’m really w- interested in your findings. but, yes. He says, “Context, context, context,” which is totally true.

[00:47:25] Jeff Sieh: And he says also, “Start simple. Avoid vibe coding. Pick, a thing you do every day, tell your AI about it, and ask how it can help.” That’s great, great advice. So as we kind of wrap this thing up,

[00:47:41] Jeff Sieh: I wanna talk about Generator, which is your podcast, which is really great. I love it because I nerd out about creating, creativity and creators and all that stuff.

[00:47:45] Jeff Sieh: but I wanna talk about as, a- and let, I want you to talk about your, your podcast and promote that and tell people where they can find it. But Generator goes into the parts of the creative life that most people skip, like the hard stuff, right? The doubt, the money, feeling isolated, if it’s [00:48:00] even worth it or not at the end of the day.

[00:48:02] Jeff Sieh: After all these episodes, the 70 plus that you’ve done so far, what is the one thing that nearly every creator is carrying?

[00:48:10] Matt Stagliano: That’s a great question. I think it’s the fact that we don’t feel we’re good enough, that it’s not necessarily imposter syndrome, but what it is is no matter how many years you’ve been doing the thing, there’s this feeling that you’re not gonna be able to p- to produce it on demand, right? You know you’re good, but it was kind of luck,

[00:48:31] Matt Stagliano: And it, and it, it rides this line between fear and imposter syndrome and just experience and giving zero Fs about anything. you have to exist in that world, and what I’ve found is the people that have, that had the longest, you know, careers are the ones that just learn to carry that better. They exist even though, in addition to the fact that they have all this fear.

[00:48:54] Matt Stagliano: So over years of these conversations, and a lot of them borne out [00:49:00] of the vulnerability that we all felt in COVID, I found that the conversations that I was having in private, on the streets, at networking events, in dark corners of clubs, right? When I’m having these conversations outside of the public eye, people were opening up about all of this stuff in their business, and it really kind of broke the illusion of the creator world for me because I realized there’s so much smoke and mirrors.

[00:49:29] Matt Stagliano: There’s so much lipstick that people put on the pig of creativity in trying to make it look good and trying to make themselves look better and get vanity numbers instead of just being who they are, right? And again, we come to that overperformance. So when I look at who I’ve had on Generator, and the first many episodes were some of the best photographers in the world.

[00:49:52] Matt Stagliano: And the reason I wanted to bring them on specifically was because they have the same issues that [00:50:00] someone that just picked up a brand-new camera two weeks ago has. There’s no difference in it. We all feel this all the same way. But there are techniques and skills and experience that you can get along the way that kind of diminish that.

[00:50:14] Matt Stagliano: But it was interesting to find that that’s kind of a common thread if you look through the 70, 80 episodes there, that that’s a common thread that weaves through almost all of them, is that there’s this feeling like they’re not good enough, and they’re, they’re plenty good. They’re plenty good.

[00:50:31] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, I know that resonates with a lot of people here who are watching

[00:50:34] Kira Pogge: totally. And do you think some of that comes from, you know, when you, when you’re a creative and you’re creating and you’re just focused on whatever medium you’re in, whether it’s finance or performance or somewhere on the myriad of things you can do on the internet and with, with the digital landscape, then we’re just focused on creativity.

[00:50:53] Kira Pogge: But when we start a business, there’s all these other jobs that we all of the sudden have that we kinda didn’t want. Like, we wanna make [00:51:00] money being creatives, but we don’t wanna be a bookkeeper and a CEO and, you know, a scheduler and all these other things. where do you see people in the creative world kind of get stuck the most on the business side?

[00:51:13] Kira Pogge: ‘Cause that can be a big struggle.

[00:51:15] Matt Stagliano: They think that business is going to betray their creativity. They think that going into business is going to remove the one thing that they love doing, when in fact, the business allows them… If your business doesn’t support your art, then you’re not saying no enough, right? Because when we’re running a business and we’re trying to be a creative, and we’re not marketing and we’re not, you know, protecting our, our art and what we want to produce, our voice, then we take any job that we can get.

[00:51:51] Matt Stagliano: And a lot of times we take those jobs that we can get, and we don’t get paid very much for them, and then we resent them, and then we have clients we don’t like or don’t want to answer the [00:52:00] phone for. And that becomes a cycle you get trapped in. Whereas if you can say no a little bit more and really protect and put out the voice that you want to put out.

[00:52:11] Matt Stagliano: I’m not saying it’s an easier path. I’m not saying the money comes faster. But what you find is that the best bodies of work that are out there were built around people saying no to the stuff that they didn’t want to do. So I think when people get into the business as being a creative, they have to understand that you have to approach both with the same passion and zeal.

[00:52:35] Matt Stagliano: You have to be able to go after your creativity with all that heart and passion that you’ve always had for it. But you have to do the same thing for business, understanding that that is going to be what allows you to do all that creative stuff in the first place. So you’ve got to learn the foundations of business.

[00:52:50] Matt Stagliano: You’ve got to learn how to run it well, and then you’ve also got to do it in a way that supports your lifestyle. That sounds a little bit nebulous, but you [00:53:00] can’t think that the business is going to hurt the creativity or that the creativity is going to keep you from running a good business. They work in, in part and parcel together

[00:53:10] Jeff Sieh: I would add one more thing too, and I know you believe in this as well, is also finding your people, a community with colleagues and people that are around you. I have masterminds that I’ve been in part for, like, over 10 years. the Ecamm community, which I know you’re a big part of the Ecamm fam.

[00:53:26] Jeff Sieh: Kira and I are in a mastermind together. I mean, so if you’re struggling, and you mentioned those things at the beginning of the, the la- to answer that question, of those, you know, feeling like, “I, I’m, I’m not creative. I gotta be creative in my business,” find the people who are, are struggling the same way you are and, and come together, ’cause it’s so much easier.

[00:53:43] Jeff Sieh: That is what’s changed everything for my business, is finding people and colleagues, because you’re not limited to, to your location anymore. Like, in Maine. I’m in Texas. Kira’s in… Where are you at, Kira? I don’t even know where you’re at, Kira. Kira’s, who knows? She’s probably watching this sh- New York.

[00:53:57] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, she’s in New York. So I mean, all the, it’s so [00:54:00] cool we can all come together. I don’t even know where these people are from, and we still can have a, a great time. So, find your people. Matt, this has been fabulous. I wanna give you enough time to tell people about your podcast, your, your Claude stuff, everything you got going on, where they can find you.

[00:54:12] Jeff Sieh: Thank you s- this has been such a great show. We’re gonna, we’re gonna chop the crap out of this thing and share it everywhere, so it’s gonna be so much fun. But where can people find you?

[00:54:19] Matt Stagliano: Great. Thanks so much. so Generator Podcast is the podcast and most of the stuff that I’m doing now, @ generatorpodcast on all the social channels, generatorpodcast.com. The photography work is at stonetreecreative.com, @ stonetreecreative on all the social channels. And then the Getting Good at Claude AI, the setup system, that is on each one of the websites.

[00:54:43] Matt Stagliano: Find the downloadables area, and you can find it there. It really is just something where I saved you hours and hours and hours and hours of research, built you a manual on how to get Claude sounding the way that you sound, and cut out [00:55:00] all that trial and error at the beginning. So yeah, generatorpodcast.com, stonetreecreative.com.

[00:55:04] Matt Stagliano: That’s good enough. People can find that. And then

[00:55:06] Matt Stagliano: Speak Less, Get More is on Amazon. Go buy the

[00:55:08] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. So, and his, for you guys listening on the podcast, Matt Stagliano, spelled S-T-A-G-L-I-A-N-O and generatorpodcast.com. So go make sure you guys check that out. And the book, by the way, it’s, if you are part of the Amazon Unlimited, I was able to pick it up there, as, if you subscribe to their, their Kindle books, which I, I speed read this thing before the show.

[00:55:30] Jeff Sieh: It’s so good. I love you and Kindle books ’cause I can highlight stuff and it goes to Notion and saves it, and it’s just amazing. So, Amy Keys actually said, she can’t wait to read the book. you need to read it, Amy. You will get a lot out of it for your museum podcast. So, thank you for that.

[00:55:44] Jeff Sieh: And thank you for the chat room because you know what? We have [00:56:00] Thank you guys so much for watching today. We’ll see you guys next time. Have a great rest of the weekend. Bye everybody