SHOW TRANSCRIPT

This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

[00:00:00] Jeff Sieh: Welcome to Social Media News Live. I’m Jeff Sieh, and you’re not.

[00:00:03] Conor Brown: And I’m Connor Brown, and this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the world of social media and more.

[00:00:09] Jeff Sieh: How, have you ever wondered how one becomes a successful content creator in today’s competitive world? Or maybe you’re interested in the journey from podcasting to live streaming, or maybe, You’d like to find out about the secrets of engaging an audience both online and offline. If those questions speak to you, then you are in for a treat.

[00:00:28] Today we are excited to announce a guest who is excellent in the art of content creation. She is an expert who has transformed her passion for storytelling into a thriving career with Camo Studio. Eden Liu is going to be sharing how she got where she is, her insights, and her best tips for creating captivating content.

[00:00:47] So sit back, clear your schedule, clear your mind, and get ready for this week’s episode of Social Media News Live. Eden, thank you so much for being here today.

[00:00:55] Eden Liu: Thank you so much for having me. I’ve been following the show for a while, finally got the call up from the G League to join, uh, to get some playing time, and here we are.

[00:01:04] Jeff Sieh: right, that’s right.

[00:01:06] Conor Brown: No more Summer League for Eden. And if you don’t know who Eden is, You should, because Eden has been podcasting for over seven years and now produces and hosts live streams for Camo Studio. She specializes in collaboration, creator tools, and community engagement. We’re excited to talk about what it’s like being an in house creator and just talking about the creator community in general, Eden, thanks again for being here.

[00:01:30] Jeff Sieh: Well, we have got to do a shout out, and Eden’s been a part, she was at Creator Camp last year, uh, our friend. Go ahead and send your friends over at Ecamm. They are the sponsors of the show. You can find out more about them at ecamm. com forward slash Jeff. They have a special summer sale going on right now, where you can save 30%. you go to that website, ecamm. com forward slash Jeff, you’ll see a code there that you can enter to save on your first purchase. Um, but it’s only going on for five more days, end of July. It is gone, so go to ecamm. com forward slash Jeff. And by the way, We talked about Creator Camp. Well, sorry, they’re all sold out.

[00:01:54] But you can have a chance to actually win a ticket to Creator Camp if you go to JeffSieh. com forward slash win. You can enter for a chance to win your very own ticket to Ecamm’s Creator Camp. And, um, we will be giving a secret code for even more entries at the end of the show. So stick around for that.

[00:02:11] All right. We’re going to jump right into this because Eden, you have a fascinating story. Like I said, I listened to you and James Hicks interview that was, uh, on, on YouTube. Uh, and you ha you have a kind of a fascinating story, but I want it for you to share kind of the story of your unconventional path to becoming a content creator.

[00:02:28] Cause it’s kind of, it’s pretty interesting.

[00:02:30] Eden Liu: Sure. So, I really like to call it an unconventional path because A, I never thought that I was ever going to be in front of a mic or a camera or live streaming or doing any type of writing or anything where people would be consuming anything that I’m expressing. So I am, however, was always an avid podcast, podcast listener.

[00:02:53] You know, when they popped up and we all found out about what they were in like 2012, everyone’s listening to podcasts, even though we don’t really know what a podcast is. I found this special. Sports podcast on ESPN. It was the True Hoop Basketball podcast and it was just such a good show. They had like a roster of sports guys that they would rotate throughout the week.

[00:03:11] There was different shows for different days of the week and I just started to like tweet about it because that was when like the peak of basketball Twitter was like You know, it was just thriving. It was before all of the casuals joined in on basketball Twitter, so it was still a cool space then. Um, and I just started tweeting about the show, like my favorite moments, or like sort of adding my own commentary, similarly to how we often add like our own commentary into the live chat of a live stream.

[00:03:38] Um, and then, um, I just, you know, tweeted casually, never thought that anyone would actually see them. And then one day, I get a DM from the producer of the podcast, Jade Hoy. He was my first producer ever, and he just asked me, like, for some thoughts about the show, asked me if I wanted to hop on a call with him, actually.

[00:03:55] And I’m like, what do you mean, hop on a call? Like, what does that even mean? Like, I, you’re, You’re like a, you know, a super producer to me. You produce this amazing show that I listen to like every day that I love, and you want to ask me for a call? Like, I, what is this? Is this a scam? I didn’t know what was happening.

[00:04:12] It was the most normal phone call you could have imagined. I hopped on this call with, with the producer, He just starts talking to me like I’m his best friend and that he’s known me for years and I’m just going along with the flow and like he asked me some thoughts about the show and we’re just chopping it up for about like 20 minutes and then at the end he’s like oh do you want to come on the show and I’m like I’m like some random on basketball Twitter what do you mean come on the show and then he’s like yeah well you know we have like this Friday mailbag podcast as you know you listen to it you’ve commented on it many times which I’m like in my head I’m like I never thought anyone saw these comments in the first place.

[00:04:45] Um, so he was like, you obviously get the show. Do you want to come on? And I’m like, yeah, of course. Like you have to say yes. When your favorite podcast asks you to come on as a guest, even if you have absolutely no idea what that means or what you’re going to be doing there. And so, I way overprepped for a guest appearance, so it’s called The Friday Mailbag, and it’s the show that I actually still do to this day.

[00:05:07] Um, it’s called The Friday Mailbag, so basically, the show is taking questions, mailbag questions, from an, from an audience. And so, I don’t know why I felt like I needed to do all this paperwork. Prepping for a mailbag show, because it’s not like I have the questions ahead of time, but, so I prepped some questions to bring to the show, as they did for sometimes when they would bring guests on, and I did that, and usually they just had the guest on once, as a one off, and then, you know, there’s a new guest, and then, you know.

[00:05:32] I just know that next thing I know, I was on the show regularly every week, and I have no idea how I got there or what I was still doing there seven years later, but I am still here, seven years later, doing the same Friday Mailbag podcast. I also, in between, was working on a few different shows with them, especially in the beginning, um, but now with, you know,

[00:05:53] I’m still doing the original show I was on, not doing as much as I was in the beginning, but I’m still part of it, and that’s sort of how I got involved in content creation to begin with, is, is, I literally feel like someone put Plucked me out of a hat. Like my name out of a drawing, like,

[00:06:10] Jeff Sieh: yeah, WebSquadron says exactly, always seize the opportunity that, I mean, that, that is very, very true. Now, what was, what were you doing before that? Did you have any experience in like podcast interviewing or producing or any of

[00:06:23] Eden Liu: so what I was doing at that time, I had been producing events in New Orleans. I lived in New Orleans for 10 years. I was doing event, operations, training, logistics for special events, block parties, fashion shows. So I would say that the only preparation that those soft skills that event production gave me was the ability to like organize things and like be prepared for the unknown.

[00:06:47] and Like coordinate with people, but other than that, none of it had anything to do, I guess you could argue that teaching, training people on how to, how they should behave at an event and how to not overserve alcohol. I guess that’s content in a sense, it’s educational somewhat, but that’s a little bit of a stretch, you know, so that’s, that’s about, um, all the content creation that I did before then.

[00:07:08] Jeff Sieh: Wow. That is just amazing. Go ahead.

[00:07:11] Conor Brown: You can always, you know, look for skills that you’ve done in a role and kind of apply it to other stuff. You know, like what I always talk about, like having worked in the theme parks here in Florida, that doesn’t seem very like markety, like it’s applicable to a marketing career that I’m doing now. But it taught me really crystal clear effective communication, right?

[00:07:32] Especially in like a high paced, really, really fast environment. That’s important. And, and clarity and being as concise as possible. That’s what marketing is all about, you know, so you can take all these experiences and kind of apply them to what you’re doing now. And that’s exactly what, what you did, Eden.

[00:07:47] You know, you seize the opportunity, you took what you had and, and you built on that into what you’re doing today, not just with podcasting, but, but camo. But. Going back to kind of those early experiences in podcasting, how has that, because you’ve been doing it for so long now, how has that shaped how you approach content creation today?

[00:08:08] You have a lot of experience of just showing up and recording those shows. So how have you taken what you’ve done in the past seven years or however long it’s been and apply it to how you create content today?

[00:08:19] Eden Liu: So I actually have a kind of funny story about that because podcasts, In 2016, 2017, when I first got started, we, they were recorded and edited. We knew that podcast was going to be recorded and edited to be released later, but we treated every session like they were live. This actually wasn’t so much intentional as it was the team of people that was on the podcast.

[00:08:44] They were all sports radio guys, like through and through. So I got my start in podcasting, podcasting alongside like, Zach Harper, Amin Elhassan, like sports radio professionals who don’t do silence, you know, like now a few years into like live streaming and content creation, it’s like, we know that like meaningful pauses and silences can be really effective for the audience to be able to digest what you’re saying, or like, just to make a point a little bit.

[00:09:10] I know that now, but that wasn’t the type of content I was creating when I first started podcasting. That’s something that’s carried over because we treated every single one of those podcast recording sessions like it was live. We didn’t do silence. We filled every single single second on the show. That like, that’s really translated to me being ready for live streaming.

[00:09:30] When I first started at Camo, I knew I was going to be doing like product videos and like doing Zoom calls with customers. I never thought that I was going to be doing as much live streaming as I am now, but now it’s like my favorite podcast. Part of the job. Like I love doing, I love producing and hosting live streams and the podcasting experience also because it was never like my project, I was a part of someone else’s project that it was like I had to really learn how to like show up and do my part and like to let go of the come that comes with when you are a part of a collective rather than like creating content and being like your own creative director.

[00:10:09] So there was just like a lot of things that I’ve learned through that experience that. That just sort of evolved into how I create content today. And like, feeling, treating every show like it was live, even though it was recorded and edited, is a huge part of like, helping me feel prepared in, in being able to do what I do now.

[00:10:29] Jeff Sieh: So, you know, what do you think some of the, you know, the two mediums are pretty different. Like, recording, you know, I have friends who record to tape, is what we always would say. You know, you record it, and then you go back and edit it like you say. And then there’s the live stuff. Like, what we do every Friday is live.

[00:10:44] It’s raw. I love getting the comments, like exactly from Chris Stone says, you know, such a great story, they saw Eden’s talent and seized the opportunity. It’s like I love being able to pull up and talk back and forth with people during the show. But what, what, How do you, when you like, so you were doing this podcast for seven years, you were showing up, you were kind of creating content.

[00:11:14] And then you went to camo where you’re kind of doing your own live streams. It’s not you with four other guys. It’s you, right? It’s you and maybe a guest or something. How is that transition? Did you have to like really flex on another muscle? Is there things you, you really started to kind of look at yourself and hone in on?

[00:11:28] How did you handle that transition?

[00:11:30] Eden Liu: Oh yeah, honestly, I’m not gonna lie. It, it was terrifying at first, because here, I, I’m like used to having four or five people on a show with me at once. And even my first few appearances, it At Camo were like with Leap Into Live or, you know, it was on other people’s shows. So like I had someone else to guide the conversation.

[00:11:48] I didn’t feel like I had to carry it all. But this is actually, this is a little bit of me giving a little bit of a secret into who I am, my secret life as a K pop stan. Is I actually learned a lot about live streaming from watching K pop, my favorite K pop artists live stream. Because it’s them by themselves.

[00:12:11] And they usually, like, have such a chill demeanor, and obviously these are, like, super pop stars with, like, zillions of people watching at a time, and I’m just live streaming some camo stuff to, like, maybe 20 people who may or may not ask questions. I didn’t know what the vibe was, but I just always Thought back to like the chill vibe that my favorite artists were able to create on a live stream by themselves and create like comfort within a Livestream session even if they weren’t necessarily talking the whole time they often weren’t there’s a lot of silence There’s a lot of you know, they’re reading the comments right now or they’re eating or which actually eating broadcast That’s like my dream content.

[00:12:52] Well, that might be another whole other content topic, but But like experiencing that like And being able to ground myself with the experience that I got as a viewer from watching someone else’s live stream that I enjoyed helped me curate the vibe that I curate today in my office hours. And then, I sort of like, the more you do it, it becomes muscle memory, and you’re like, you start to find little things that help you, yourself, even without, like, you know, Always going back to like, oh, what did this person do when they were on a live stream by themselves?

[00:13:25] Like, I just started to find sort of like my own ways to fill silence or my own rhythm with bringing in comments. And it was, it was a pretty big adjustment though. That’s why I love to tell people that I, I’m, I’m, I want to collaborate. Can we collaborate? Because I’m just like, I don’t want to do solo content.

[00:13:39] I don’t want to have to do stuff by myself.

[00:13:41] Jeff Sieh: is different. It is really like when Connor is, you know, off on a boat somewhere and I, somebody can fill in and I, I do it myself. It’s a different skillset. Like you have to like, You know, you can’t like, you know, like a lot of times I’ll, I’ll switch to Conor and like, I’m like blowing my nose or something, you know, like,

[00:13:52] Eden Liu: yeah.

[00:13:52] Jeff Sieh: and you know, I mean, you don’t, it’s a, it’s another person.

[00:13:56] That’s the only reason I have Conor so I can blow my nose. Uh, but, uh, no, just kidding. He is amazing. But, uh, it’s harder. It’s a, and even solos, even like when you don’t even have an interview, that is, that is a real skillset. I call that’s back in the Periscope days when you just sit there and blab to a camera.

[00:14:09] Eden Liu: Oh,

[00:14:10] Periscope. Yeah,

[00:14:12] Jeff Sieh: I didn’t say Google Plus, Chris, so you can’t drink. Um, but yeah, so anyway, that’s, um, I, it is a very different skill set when you have to hold the show on your own, and that’s why I, I prefer having a co host, just because it just seems for me, the way I do things, it just seems to flow better for me.

[00:14:24] It’s easier.

[00:14:25] Conor Brown: For the first few years of, of my podcast, I had a, a co host who’s my best friend, Hank, cause I knew the only way I was going to be able to start is if I had that security blanket. Now, he also loved what we were talking about. He wanted to be a part of it just as much as I did, but I knew that that’s how it I had to start and then you take it from, from there.

[00:14:45] Um, speaking of Google Chris is, is, uh, responding with a lot of great comments, including a comment on my hair. Yes, uh, this is my real hair. It’s not a wig. Uh, they can’t even manufacture this, but he also says, he also says, learning outside your space is so important. Eden is a master at this. And I totally agree with that.

[00:15:04] I think. In order to be a great content creator, you have to be a great content consumer. And that doesn’t just mean sitting on your butt and watching as much YouTube as possible. It means as you’re watching something, being fully engaged in it and understanding how are they captivating us? How, what kind of tips or tricks are they doing?

[00:15:22] And then taking that and learning from it, kind of like what Eden was doing with With her K pop, uh, uh, stars that she was following, you know, learning from, from that sort of, of, of aspects and, and seeing what’s already working. Right. But Eden, you know, if someone is an inspiring content creator and they’re consuming a whole bunch of stuff right now, and they, they love what they’re seeing and they have dreams to do that themselves. What kind of advice would you give to them that are just starting out that are are ready to get it and, and kind of take it to the next level? joining

[00:15:51] Eden Liu: I would say that the first thing if for people that are just starting out is to understand and to truly believe that your voice is Is valid that your perspective that your experiences are valid and that they have something to offer. And I don’t mean that the content you’re creating has to be something incredibly meaningful that you’re offering a lot of value so much as, this is something that took me a very long time to understand because I had a massive impostor syndrome being someone that didn’t even aspire to do content that was just thrown into the situation basically.

[00:16:26] There’s a zillion people out there that are creating content, but there’s also even more people that are just consuming content, and you don’t know when it’s your experience and your perspective that someone needs to hear. Um, and then the second thing, probably like most importantly, is to really just do it.

[00:16:42] Eden Liu: I know there are so many people that I talk to about content creation, and I’m like this with my own content. I create a ton of content for Camo, but like when it comes to sort of like my own content, I get sort of decision paralysis for what do I want to create content about, or like the, you know, the perfectionist thing where it’s like, I, you know, never feel like it’s gonna be good enough to put out there, but then it’s like, It is.

[00:17:05] And you just have to do it. Like, I hate to go all Nike on you guys, but like content creation, you can’t just think about it. There is all the preparation, all of the testing, all of the research, all of the best practices you can research and find and do learning about. But until you actually do it and get in the reps to be able to learn from them and evolve your own system and your own process into like, really shape your own content, You’re not, you’re never going to do anything.

[00:17:31] Like, because that first piece of content you put out is never actually your final product. The product is always evolving. And. We all look back on our first pieces of content and we’re like, whoa. I mean, it’s not always cringe, but it’s not who you

[00:17:45] are anymore. Yeah,

[00:17:47] Jeff Sieh: it is.

[00:17:48] Eden Liu: I didn’t want to, I was trying to be kind to the audience.

[00:17:50] Jeff said it. It’s his show. He’s allowed to say that. I’m, you know, I’m, I’m being a good

[00:17:54] Jeff Sieh: You all stink. Everybody stinks in the beginning. You know, one thing, and I’m going to go back to your interview with James Hicks, and that’s on YouTube for any guys want to go check it out. It was really good. Um, you mentioned always trying to, and we don’t know who said it first, but, um, cause James is going to make a t shirt out of it.

[00:18:08] Um,

[00:18:09] Eden Liu: percent less worse.

[00:18:11] Jeff Sieh: 1 percent less worse. Like if you can go and create something 1 percent less work, you are making improvement. And I thought that was gold because that really is what we’re all trying to do. Like just get a little bit better and you’re making progress. So

[00:18:24] Eden Liu: 1 percent less worse is my favorite thing. Every time you show up, every time you get in front of the camera, every time you get in front of the mic, just be 1 percent less worse than you were before.

[00:18:30] Jeff Sieh: yeah, that’s great. And on that note, this is a great question from Syed says, um, Any tips for zero viewer streams, uh, especially when just, uh, starting with live streams. Now, this is an issue and everybody starts with zero, you know, everybody was on there and their mom just showed up and you’re like, mom, don’t say that in front of everybody.

[00:18:49] But you know, you know, but what would you tell Said here about the zero viewer streams?

[00:18:55] Eden Liu: Yo, Saeed. So first of all, I assumed every single one of my live streams for like, I don’t know, I assume my live streams today would still have zeros. I still treat my live streams as if, I prep for them as if there will be no one in the, in the live chat. So my thing is, is to have sort of topics that you want to hit and topics that you want to talk about and topics that, You know, that you can sort of sound out yourself as talk through them, like, and it’s okay to practice.

[00:19:22] It’s okay to have a script written out. I’m not saying read the script while you’re on the live stream, but I do this a lot where, just like for example for this show, Jeff sent me some questions. I definitely didn’t type out very long an essay for every single one just so I could be prepared. I definitely didn’t do that, but you could if you wanted to.

[00:19:43] And then, that sort of gives your brain, like, a sense of comfort, in that I am prepared for this. So, Saeed, if you have zero viewers on a live stream, or if that’s what you’re prepping for, man, prep a monologue! Prep an hour long monologue, and just be ready for it, like, and, you know, like, be ready to break that, break that monologue if you see someone pop into the chat and say hello to them, but, like, just be prepared, like, I know that it’s a mental hurdle to feel like you are contenting to no one, But like, it’s a rep.

[00:20:12] Just do it. Like you’re getting in a practice rep. Like, I want to say that I’m blessed to not have had any zero stream viewers, but I kind of feel like it would be a good challenge to To have and to see how would I carry myself through it. And, you know, I’m not saying I hope it happens, but like, I think it would be a really fun exercise to see how any of us that do content regularly would be in a zero viewer live stream, because it’s, it’s like you’re thrown in the fire, essentially.

[00:20:39] You got to carry that show. You got to carry that show.

[00:20:41] Jeff Sieh: Oh, I’ve been in it before. We’ve had streams go down before. And then Connor and I have started to back up and we had like zero. Before because it was just the internet gods were not smiling upon us. So it is it’s not easy to do but it is you’re exactly right. It’s doing the reps Um about the being prepared like I always have three.

[00:20:58] I always have three sections with five questions each That’s my prep for the show. I do that. That’s what I do to make myself be prepared. Now, Doc Rock will argue with me, and we’ve been on this before, like, he thinks you should never have, and Lou Mangiello is the same way, never have questions. Like, and I’m like, because he, because it gives it more flow and feel, and I’m like, yeah, but then you have guests who need something.

[00:21:18] Like, I would rather have it than not. Now, you can argue either way. It’s, it doesn’t matter. It’s your show. You can do whatever you want. So whatever makes you feel like you’re prepared, I say, do that. And mine was always like, have those things ready. Cause you never know what’s going to happen. You could have geese outside your

[00:21:33] Eden Liu: it’s the thing is it’s like a lot of the time the prep is not just for you It’s also for the guest because like I hear you on that and it’s like I know doc is team no preparation He doesn’t want any talking points He doesn’t want to even know the show topic like but I’m like doc not everyone is a seasoned guest like you like I Feel like I’m a great guest but if a guest bombs entirely like they just don’t have anything to say or they just are completely unprepared that is so much more work than i that i have to do to save the show versus if i just give them something to prep for ahead of time

[00:22:09] Jeff Sieh: Uh, Corey says, uh, uh, forget impostor syndrome. If you feel it, we all do. Remember an intern pushed a bug update straight to production with no identifiers and crashed half the planet and it’s still ongoing. So there’s always somebody who’s had a worse day than you have. Um, Yeah, and then you have your, your, uh, your, uh, your fan club here saying, don’t sell yourself short, Eden.

[00:22:25] They literally can’t do the mailbag without you.

[00:22:28] Eden Liu: y’all briscoe shouts to my guy

[00:22:30] Jeff Sieh: yeah. So, um, and, and yeah, and Richard says, that’s it. Nike trademarked the best phrase of all time. Just do it. It is. What is it? The, um, Success is just showing up. I think, I can’t remember who said that, but, uh, and Saheed says, yeah, suck less each time.

[00:22:43] Yeah, very, very true. So, um, yeah, less worse. Everybody likes that. Yeah. Ralph, um, Ralph puts out like a daily show and I’m like, man, you talk about getting the reps in. He is the band when it comes to that. So, um,

[00:22:55] Conor Brown: know what, Jeff, actually Ralph asked an awesome question too that kind of goes along this theme. The same vein. He’s so consistent. But he says, uh, he has a question. He’s saying, do you see value in doing a live show? He already does a daily show, but he feels like it would allow people to ask me questions live, which is the whole point of his show.

[00:23:14] I mean, his show’s called Ask Ralph. Right? And it’s, and I were talking about this last night in our, our mastermind group that, that we do, um, the benefit of doing a live show, even if you are doing a daily show, you know, I guess. My question is to both of you, because I don’t do the live show other than showing up here each week, right?

[00:23:33] What’s the value beyond just doing a recorded show versus the live show?

[00:23:38] Jeff Sieh: Eden, I’ll let you go with that one.

[00:23:40] Eden Liu: You let me go? All right. Yo, I’m gonna be perfectly honest. So I hope host a live streamed office hours for Camo, our software, and it is no no scripting. Like, it’s just Q& A. Questions, bring your Camo questions, and I’ve gotten so much feedback about People just being so grateful that, that we offer this. A lot of the times it’s even people that aren’t able to make the live stream.

[00:24:01] They’re just like, it is so amazing that you’re offering a space for people to just come in and ask questions. And we actually do usually get a bunch of meaningful questions. And we got a bunch of feature requests and like, Also, a lot of questions that often people would never make the effort to like reach out to you via email or like write to you a DM for, but because you’re already there and offering a space that they feel like they can ask sort of like the more simple questions or like a question that You know, you might feel awkward writing a whole email out for, but like being able to answer, take a question live and answer it for them right then and there is so, so, so valuable for community building.

[00:24:42] It’s, it makes the experience, A true two way engagement versus even when you put out a recorded video, yes, you can engage with the comments later, but it’s not in real time. You’re answering questions for people in real time. Like, do you know like how valuable time is and that now that they don’t have to wait for you to check your email and get back to them, like you just answered their question, you just saved them time.

[00:25:06] Like, we’ve gotten so much incredible feedback on all of the live stream stuff that we do that I’m just like, yes. Just do it live, do it live, and then you don’t have to worry about posts either as much if you’re doing it live, but that’s another topic.

[00:25:18] Jeff Sieh: That’s a great point. Now, one of the things I’ll say is another, uh, Ecamm’s a master at that, because that’s how they, their community, when they do their live stuff and demos and stuff, they do a really great job. So if you haven’t checked that out, make sure you go and find that their community. They have one on Discord, they have one on Facebook, so check them.

[00:25:31] Um, I would say this is what I talked to, uh, last night with Connor and the guys in the Mastermind was that I think live video is going to continue to become more and more important as the rise of AI That starts coming because I can make a really good, uh, avatar right now of Eden and type out some stuff and it will look pretty close.

[00:25:47] And you gotta remember, this is the worst that stuff’s gonna be. Like it’s only gonna get better, but there’s still not a way for AI to. Be me and answer questions and have the joke that I have with Chris Stone about Google Plus and these, these people who show up like Ask Ralph and, and Jim Fuse and all these people who show up almost every week, they don’t have, AI is not going to have a relationship with it.

[00:26:06] And I think people are going to be desperate for that. I think brands and companies are going to realize to connect with their audiences, they’re going to need to live stream because you can’t fake it. Like, geese were outside of my office one time. Like, AI can’t come up with that stuff, right? So anyway, anyway, that’s,

[00:26:21] Eden Liu: on that point, though, on the point, though, of the geese outside of your office, Those are the moments that people love the most because they make them feel like you are a real person that they are making a connection with. Like beyond just the answering questions for them in real time, it’s the human connection.

[00:26:40] Like, People just being like, yo, like, I’m like, yo, I’m really thirsty. I really want to go grab some water. They’re like, yo, go get some water. It’s fine. Like, you know, you can break a live stream and get some water, but it’s like, you know, it’s the people when people see you as a human and not a software also, like I’m using software because that’s like my example.

[00:26:57] They’re also a lot more likely to be a lot kinder to you when you interact with them. Like because Yeah, exactly, that’s what I mean. It’s like, how many times have we gotten frustrated at something that doesn’t work the way it’s supposed to, and next thing you know, you’re writing out an angry email to the support team, and it’s like, you know it’s not their fault, but like, this happened at a really inconvenient time, and it’s like, when you build a human connection, With your users as a software, especially with the rise of AI and all the things that Jeff just mentioned with like, with AI and, and how content is becoming content vomit, it’s all becoming a little bit more homogenized.

[00:27:33] it’s, the human moments that really stand out to people.

[00:27:37] Jeff Sieh: there’s a

[00:27:37] Conor Brown: is so funny. Yeah, cause I, I scream at A L E X A all the time or as soon as someone answers, I’m like, uh, representative, representative, representative, you know,

[00:27:46] Eden Liu: Yeah.

[00:27:47] Jeff Sieh: exactly.

[00:27:48] Conor Brown: them the benefit of the doubt.

[00:27:49] Jeff Sieh: So this is a great point with, uh, showing up, uh, and nobody’s there at first and it, a web squadron says, uh, showcase what you can do. It took me three months to build a regular audience and viewership grows and drops and eventually regulars become your trusted circle. Of deviants and fans.

[00:28:02] Yes, I totally agree with that. That’s a great great point. So

[00:28:05] Eden Liu: and I’ve popped in on Imron web, squadron’s streams, he does, um, web stuff. It’s really cool to see him engage with his audience and it’s like, it’s, it’s, it’s mostly site stuff, so it’s not really stuff that I have that much expertise in, but like when I’m watching. I, you know, I, I watch a lot of other people’s live streams to learn from them, and I’m just like, it is so cool when you can see a cohesive community being built through a live stream, like, Ecamm does it really well, Jeff, I think you guys do it really well as well.

[00:28:30] Like, when you see, sort of like, you have, like, your core people that show up in every stream, you know, like, and it’s like, That’s like becomes like when you know, those people are going to be there for you. It gives you energy to keep showing up to

[00:28:41] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, and Kira is also one of those core people and she goes we also want to set up guests for success Often there are friends or connections We would just want to have as much fun as we as we can do on the show Which is very very true and that’s you know, like Ecamm camo community all this stuff You know there we all are kind of get on each other’s streams and it’s just it’s just fun And it is a real community that we have.

[00:28:59] Conor Brown: And I think, you know, brands are, are understanding the importance of, you know, at being a person and showing up and doing these live streams and coming up with those moments that are not AI created. Like, you know, the geese thing. I mean, in the moment Jeff is sweating. when the geese are flying over his man.

[00:29:15] He’s probably in through like two or three bowling shirts during that episode, but we’re still talking about that moment. Cause it’s real and it’s raw and it’s cool. And that’s what I think the benefit of, um, live streaming and being a person and having a face first marketing plan, like I call it, it’s not.

[00:29:34] A faceless person. It’s, you know, exactly. Oh, Eden. Eden’s with Camo. I know Camo. I know Eden. They go together. So brands are seeing this, but Eden for you, you know, what does your role as an in house creator for Camo studio entail? Like when you wake up, is it daily thing? Is it just the office hours? But what kind of is this in house creator role that you’ve built?

[00:29:57] Eden Liu: so the funny thing is as you talk about There being like an actual human face tied to a brand is that I remember my first call With someone, I forgot what even the call context was, but it was like on Zoom, and then the first thing they said they were like, Oh, you’re the person that’s on the site.

[00:30:15] You’re the person that’s on the landing page. You’re in the product videos, and it was like it blew my mind that like someone would recognize me from that. And I’ve also had like people meet me at events and they’re like, oh, I thought that that was just like, I didn’t know that you were an actual person that worked there.

[00:30:30] Like, we thought you were just like a hired model for the landing pages or something. Um, but to answer your question, so the funny thing is, my role as an in house creator was sort of shaped as I joined the team. Like, my technical, my, Um, actual title is Customer Support Manager and I lead community building.

[00:30:46] Um, none of that actually has creator in it, but it started out as doing little mini product demos for our product updates. And then it became, oh, we should just do actual product update videos to show off all of the new features in like a more polished way. And then, next thing I know, I am joining, you know, live streams three months into the job for, with social media.

[00:31:06] Ecamm and other companies to talk about camo and, you know, did a lot of work with Prezi back in the day as well. And it just became like, next thing I knew, I was just like working in video all the time. And then going on a lot of people’s shows made me realize that we should just have our own show. We need to host our own shows and have like our own platform.

[00:31:25] And so I actually am the one that started our YouTube channel and I didn’t make all of the videos on it, but I, I did. I like to say that I built that YouTube channel from the ground up. Um, Um, and. Cause I am the one that planned to do, you know, one live, one office hours, live stream a month, one camo costume a month.

[00:31:41] And then like, I also choose which video topics we cover based on the audience questions that we get in live streams or that come through the help desk. And so it is a lot of representing the brand through video. Also, it helps that we’re a video software. Like if, if I, this wasn’t a video software, I don’t know that I’d be on video this much, but I’m really glad that I am.

Marker

[00:32:01] Eden Liu: Um, and so it’s, Working also with a team to sort of shape brand stuff and brand vibe, which is actually kind of something that I, I didn’t really have like strong marketing experience. Like I’ve had like event marketing experience that goes with doing event logistics and operations, but like I never had marketing like training or anything.

[00:32:21] And so getting to work with my growth team on the brand stuff has been really cool because it’s like being an in house creator also means you’re not on an island by yourself. You have input, which can be a balancing act sometimes, though, because it’s a little bit different than, say, like, the experience of being a creator and, like, Partnering with a brand on like a campaign because in in those situations you are collaborating w with a brand to create content.

[00:32:48] And usually that creative control is like negotiable somehow. But when you’re an in-house creator for a brand, you are the brand. You have to be the brand the entire time. And so being brand minded has something been something that I learned on the job and I actually. I feel like I may have fallen too deep into it sometime because then sometimes when it comes to like creating content outside of camo, I can, I feel like I am still creating content as camo if that, if that

[00:33:14] Jeff Sieh: Oh yeah, I totally. So my path was kind of similar. Like I got hired to run Pinterest for social media examiner that led to another thing doing their Instagram and then it led to this and this and then doing their live shows. And then, you know, I was, I was the, they were my biggest client for like five years.

[00:33:27] So I understand how that works. Did they, was there an ad that you went and said, Hey, I want to be a creating content. Did they know you and say, Hey, why don’t you come create content for us? How did you get the actual gig? For camo.

[00:33:40] Eden Liu: So, yeah, that’s a great question and I actually got the gig mostly based on my event production past and the podcasting that I was doing because they were looking for someone to run the customer support team that was also going to be comfortable on camera. As a video, a camera software, it was a team of developers that didn’t have anyone that wanted to be on camera.

[00:34:03] So their priorities were to find someone that. was comfortable on camera and willing to do camera stuff. I did not, I’m going to be perfectly honest. I had no idea I was going to be doing as much live stream and video content as I am now. I literally had no idea. I thought it was going to be little product videos here and there.

[00:34:18] And that was it. Um, but it’s also part of like, what I love about my role is that I’ve gotten to shape the role as an in house creator along with camo, if that makes sense. Like, this, and that was in the job description, like, they were looking for someone with a set of soft skills, able to manage a team, able to be organized with process, and, so, Someone that was good at communication.

[00:34:38] Remember, um, Connor, you mentioned like the communication skills that I had before from doing event production and being effective with communication. That’s also helped me in doing content and like the podcasting stuff, which I’d only been doing for about three or four years at that time. Yeah. Cause I’ve been on this job for three years.

[00:34:54] Um, that showed that I was able to speak clearly and concisely to an audience. Um, even though it wasn’t very much video back then. And my event. all so much for joining me today, and I will see you in the next one. Like a collaborative effort between me and Camo. And like, when I started to see like the power of like what Ecamm was doing with the Leap Into Live event that I did three months into the job, like I was like, Oh, this is what I should be doing more of and will be doing more of.

[00:35:31] And I basically, you know, I get my ideas. I pitched them to the bosses and we either agree to do them on sometimes they get shot down. Um, I, I have, I have a few really great ideas that have gotten shot down. Um, but I, I still hold on to hope that I’m going to be able to do those shows one day and it’s, it’s a give and take.

[00:35:46] So, um, I think I, I’m really blessed to have a lot of creative control over the work that I do and it, it, it’s given me the feeling that I’m building as like, I’m, I’m building camo along with them and that’s like a really meaningful feeling.

[00:36:00] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. There’s a great comment here. Um, Chris says, I never get mistaken for a site model. You know, I have that. Me too, Chris. I’ve never, ever had that.

[00:36:09] Eden Liu: Even with the beard, I feel

[00:36:10] Jeff Sieh: No, no. Mostly if I, if I go outside and stand real still, then it, people like get the body bags out and stuff. So go ahead.

[00:36:19] It’s Connor.

[00:36:19] Conor Brown: I think it’s more I mistake you. Didn’t I see you on a wanted poster somewhere?

[00:36:24] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, I know it’s like, I don’t make duck calls either. I get that a lot. So,

[00:36:28] Conor Brown: that’s right. Uncle Si. Um, Um, I think, you know, for a lot of us, we have these kind of Two lives, I guess you could say when it comes to professional, right? It’s, it’s who we’re working for and then what we’re doing on the side, right? And sometimes we’re creating content for both and sometimes it can overlap.

[00:36:45] Sometimes they’re totally separate. Eden, you’re experiencing that a lot. You know, you kind of just mentioned how sometimes you feel like you’re creating content for yourself, but you’re still creating content for camo. So I imagine that that’s kind of a hard balance, but in your role as in house creator, how do you balance like.

[00:37:04] The brand guidelines for camo and the brand goals for camo with what you want to do stylistically in your personal creative voice. How do you balance that?

[00:37:14] Eden Liu: it’s, it’s a lot of communication at first, if I’m being honest, um, I am three years into the job and I have things in a point where I feel comfortable and like, I know which I, I kind of have an idea of how I know my ideas will be recepted at this point. That wasn’t the case the first, the first year of the job.

[00:37:33] Like there was a lot of back and forth and a lot of, like, it really does take, it’s a lot of balance. It’s a lot of balance and just really, I also do a lot of yoga. So, you know, balance is something like that’s very core to my life. Um, But I will also say I have become mostly brand first these days, and that’s something that I am trying to strike a stronger balance for, but being brand first means that my content is going to be safe and I’m not going to get in trouble for it.

[00:38:02] And. That’s actually, you know, we all know about cancel culture. And of course, I’m not talking about anything that I would get canceled over. But when, when you are an in house creator for a brand, when you’re the face of a brand, even in your own content, you have to keep that in mind. Like that’s just the reality of it.

[00:38:19] You’re going to have to make some, you’re going to have to find balance for yourself in what you want to express creatively and what you feel like aligns with the brand. And I don’t think that that is something that is going to, to change very soon because brands have a, a certain appearance and a certain vibe that they’re trying to communicate and be perceived as, and if you are going to be an in house creator for a brand, that is something that you’re going to have to accept.

[00:38:42] Um, so it, it, I do think that there, it, not everyone can do it. Not everyone can do it. So it’s

[00:38:48] kind of depends on what you’re looking to do.

[00:38:50] Jeff Sieh: And it also goes back to like, even if you want to be hired as an influencer to make a product video or something like that, you’ve got to keep in mind what you’re You know how you are portrayed in other platforms because that can affect your bottom line like family like you know like some some family companies won’t touch certain people because of you know some of the the content they create so you have to be very very careful.

[00:39:12] And think long term of like, okay, I’m doing this now, but, you know, I probably won’t be doing this for the rest of my life, kind of a

[00:39:19] Eden Liu: Yeah, so I have a really good example on that actually also is because so for the Friday mailbag show that I do with the podcast that I’ve been doing for seven years is we get some really random out of pocket questions sometimes because that’s the vibe that was curated on that show and that’s fine for that show.

[00:39:35] I have there since becoming, you know, an in house creator for Camo and getting this job. I sometimes just don’t answer questions that I feel like my word, I might say something that puts my image at risk and that’s fine. The people that I’ve been podcasting with understand that and they respect that.

[00:39:51] But like it, it does happen where there’s sometimes like we do video, we don’t live stream it. But sometimes I’m like, yo guys like, I, can we cut that part out before you post the video? Because I can’t actually be searchable or even have my face connected to that conversation, even if I didn’t chime in on it.

[00:40:06] So

[00:40:07] Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

[00:40:07] Eden Liu: It’s that’s the reality of it.

[00:40:09] Jeff Sieh: that’s smart. That’s, that’s very, very true. Um, I want to, and by the way, I want to talk about your, your community. I want to talk about how you, Do your collaboration community with your role at Camo Studio. And the cool thing is, I mean, I know it’s working cause you brought a lot of people here to this show, like you’ve got your community following you, which is, is a great thing.

[00:40:25] And that, I mean, that’s value to Camo that you’re building this community. So can you talk about the things that you keep top of mind when you’re, when you’re thinking about your community and how you’re doing your office hours or whatever, uh, inside of your Camo relationship?

[00:40:40] Eden Liu: this might be a little bit of a cop out answer, but I really just try to be Me I try to be very human I like to think of myself as someone that’s very good at relationship building. I’m very good at cultivating relationships I’m very good at communication. I just said i’m very good at a lot of things, but that’s not the point the point is In, when you are building community, especially on behalf of a group, I actually also did the community building effort for the podcast that I was doing, like, I led a lot of our community building events, um, you have to be someone that People want to hang out with and I’m I’m lucky to already be someone that people want to hang out with but I really just try to treat every person like a normal person like I Am genuinely interested when people leave comments with like really fascinating interesting use cases that they found for camo that’s something that we would never have thought of ourselves and some of it’s like really cool and I will just, like, whenever I see people that reach out to us, whether it’s through the help desk or if it’s, like, in a comment, I’ll just say that.

[00:41:37] I’ll be like, hey, like, it sounds like you’re doing some really cool stuff, like, do you want to hop on a call and chat and, or just, like, share a little bit more about what you do? We’d love to follow along. And it’s genuine. Like, I really try to keep that in mind. Like, it’s like, sometimes people do really cool content, but if there’s not really alignment with what we’re trying to accomplish, you know, at Camo, then it’s like, I, I, you know, even if what they’re doing is cool, that’s not necessarily someone I need to like put time into building a relationship with.

[00:42:05] And if, even if I did try to build that relationship, it wouldn’t be as genuine or effective because I would know that I should probably be putting my efforts somewhere else. So it really is. Approached from a very organic human perspective. And I will also say maybe sometimes my bosses wish that my process could go a little bit faster, but I’m like, you can’t rush friendship.

[00:42:25] You can’t rush relationship building. Like, you know, it’s, I am someone like, I meet a lot of people at events and we talk and chop it up. And I’m, I’m not going to immediately come home and ask them to come on my show after that. I’m going to, like, cultivate that relationship for three years. I’m going to, not three years, three months at least, you know, where I’m like, where I’m checking in on what they’re doing.

[00:42:43] I’m commenting on their stuff and, like, genuinely watching their shows and engaging with their comment and learning about who they are and then, like, slowly building that up over time. And then when there’s, like, a topic that comes up that, you know, we happen to want to cover and there’s alignment there, that’s when I make the ask.

[00:43:01] And. I’ve never gotten turned down yet because I like to think that my approach to relationship building is very, like, I hate using this word but, like, holistic, if that makes sense in any way. Yeah, organic. Like, it’s just, it’s not, it’s really not coming from anywhere other than, like, I’m a human, you’re a human, there’s alignment between what we do and I’m genuinely interested in seeing what we might be able to do together.

[00:43:24] Conor Brown: I think we have a couple of great questions here and one from teacher David that I really like says, do you think more branded companies should reach out to individual creators because some of the best ideas come from individual concepts or ideas? It’s almost like a notion of reaching out to like An outside consultant, right?

[00:43:43] Different eyes, different clarity, different look at things. So what do you think about that? Obviously you’re in, in kind of that situation, Eden, but brands reaching out to individual creators for help building on their, their own concepts. What do you say to that?

[00:43:57] Eden Liu: I think it’s a great idea. So I did a show recently, we all know Stephanie Garcia in this space. She just released her book, The Ultimate Guide to Influencer Marketing. And I think that is kind of what the book is about is how the relationship between brands and creators is evolving. It is evolving very quickly because brands are starting to realize the power of organic, like user generated con, you know, UGC and like, even paid partnerships, because just like the comment said, like.

[00:44:26] Individual ideas can sometimes make the content feel more relatable and like when the content is more relatable and it’s presented in a way that’s not so corporate and brandy, I’m actually going to watch it. So like when it comes to scrolling like through Instagram, for example, I scroll through all those sponsored ads unless it happens to be, it’s a creator that I’m already following, usually.

[00:44:51] And then they’re just presenting it in a way that’s similar to their usual content. It doesn’t even feel like an ad to me at that point. And so that I feel like is, is actually what’s effective these days because like a lot of, you know, MZ, like millennials and Gen Z, like, We’re trained to just like, our brains don’t even process an actual ad anymore.

[00:45:12] We just keep scrolling. Like, so I think it’s absolutely essential that especially companies that are trying to grow smaller SMEs, like, or even big, big brands, like to, to be able to maintain their standing, like they, they got to learn how to get in touch and through creators is the best way how to, how to get, how to not be out of touch.

[00:45:29] It’s, I think it’s more important to not come off as out of touch than it is to necessarily be in touch because you know, who

[00:45:34] Jeff Sieh: Right. Right. And the thing is, I think smart brands are doing that. And speaking of sponsorship, don’t forget our sponsors of the show. See how smooth and easy that was. I love Ecamm. You got it. That’s what we’re doing to make the show. That’s what we use for podcasting. It’s just an amazing tool. I was a user way before they sponsored the show.

[00:45:52] You can find out more about them at Ecamm. com forward slash Jeff there. Having a summer sale, five days left, 30 percent off if you use that code when you go to Ecamm. com forward slash Jeff. And for the people listening, I’m going to do what Dave Jackson says, it’s Ecamm, it’s Ecamm, that’s with two M’s, so, mmm, it’s so good.

[00:46:05] So, there you go. Um,

[00:46:07] Eden Liu: That’s

[00:46:07] amazing.

[00:46:07] Jeff Sieh: yeah, so, um, let’s see, um, do you, um, go ahead, Connor, I know you had a question in the comments.

[00:46:09] Conor Brown: absolutely. I know we’re just talking about great tools that we love using like Ecamm. And, you know, even if you guys out there don’t want to do live streams, I record in Ecamm exclusively, and it’s my favorite thing, uh, in the world, but tool wise for creators, um, Eden, what do you, what do you find like those couple of tools that are just indispensable that you couldn’t do your job without when it comes to working at Camo Studio, uh, in your role, what are your favorite tools?

[00:46:35] Eden Liu: Well, camo for one. No, I’m just kidding.

[00:46:37] Jeff Sieh: No, it’s good, it’s a great tool.

[00:46:40] Eden Liu: Yeah, no, I do use camo every day. Um, but outside of Camo, Ecamm is, is my, one of my top used softwares. I don’t, cannot imagine going live without it, if I’m being perfectly honest. I will be getting set up with a Windows machine, and I’m gonna have to learn how to live stream on it, and that’s the part I’m most worried about.

[00:46:57] But other than Ecamm, I would like to say, I am an Adobe, I’m Adobe girly all the way. Like, I’m on that creative suite. I, you know, I, I grew up with Photoshop and using Photoshop. Adobe Express is great. It’s a love hate with Premiere, but when it’s It’s the tool that you have been using and you know how to use, and it’s the one that you’re using, um, and, and it’s like, you know, necessary evil.

[00:47:15] I feel like, is there truly a video editor that, video editing tool that everyone that just loves across the board? There’s not. So, um, Premiere is my poison of choice, um, and I, I love, um, Tools like Descript, OpusClip, etc. I’ll be perfectly honest. I’m not that good at the repurposing. I need to be better at it.

[00:47:32] It is an area of improvement for me, um, and with the AI tools that pop up every day, I am still doing sort of like configuring on like where to make them fit in and work for me the best because right now when it comes to like AI tools, Um, I mostly just use them for unblocking, if that makes sense, like if I’m really struggling with like how to like dumb down an explanation or like just have like some, an email that it needs to be delicately worded, but I’ve not, I don’t, I don’t have like the full AI tech stack built out to totally streamline my process yet,

[00:48:03] Jeff Sieh:If you,

[00:48:03] if you are an Adobe girl, well, um, their new generative AI stuff is amazing. Like for replacing backgrounds, doing YouTube thumbnails. Now it has, even in Illustrator, you can have it create vector graphics for you. I mean, oh my gosh. Yeah. It’s yeah. Yes.

[00:48:19] Eden Liu: Oh my god, y’all. Vector, vector graphics,

[00:48:23] Jeff Sieh: so for logos and stuff, it’s, it’s pretty slick.

[00:48:25] Um, anyway, uh, I want to, you had mentioned when we had kind of done a pre, uh, chat about, uh, you coming on the show is you said, well, I just did this thing that was an offline, So, this is a live show that you did for your podcast network. Talk about that because Connor and I, we meet every year at an event called Momentum.

[00:48:42] That’s amazing that we, we, we go to and both he and I are speaking there this year. And it’s just a great live events when they’re done right are amazing. Like they just networking and teaching and training. Um, so talk about what you did and how you did it and how it kind of evolved.

[00:48:58] Eden Liu: sure. So, the live event for the podcast, it’s really just a live show, so it’s not like a full blown conference, there’s not like a bunch of sessions planned, it is, it was a weekend planned around a live show. The live show itself is basically the podcast in person though, like it’s on a stage, um, have you guys ever been to a, a live podcast show

[00:49:20] Jeff Sieh: They did one at Podcast Movement where they had, um, oh gosh, the guy who did 99 percent Invisible did one live from the stage, which was really cool.

[00:49:27] Eden Liu: Okay, well, so ours, because we have a lot of different, like, rostered panel shows, like, each show has at least four people on, so it’s like, we break it down into stages, and we have a lot of special guests, like, for this last one, my sports people will know of Nick Wright, or Bomani Jones, or Pablo Torre, who we got as special guests, um, to come on the show, the live show on stage, so it’s a stage performance, it’s just for one night, but there’s a lot of, like, community activities, um, Around it because, you know, we think about it from the perspective of we have people coming from all across America, sometimes the world, to come to this live show and experience this, we should, you know, maybe make it a little bit more than just coming to the show.

[00:50:07] And so, you know, we would like organize little get togethers on Discord, whether it’s getting food, Um, we didn’t this last time, but in the past, before the pandemic, we were doing a lot of live shows then. Also, we would have, like, a karaoke night where it’s just, like, a lot of people, people that want to come can, everyone can just join in.

[00:50:21] And, and it’s, like, a big party, a big get together with, with, with the people on the show and the listeners of the show. And it’s a lot of organization and a lot of community building and a lot of, like, It’s a lot of organization, basically. So that’s also where sort of like my event production path sort of helped with being able to like help out with community stuff is because it’s just about organization and logistics.

[00:50:41] Um, and like we would use like Discord to like, like, getting like head count, do surveys, et cetera, and to see, like, what people were interested in, and often people were really just interested in hanging out with other people. Um, so we just kinda like picked stuff that we wanted to do, like, I was like, let’s go get KBBQ, Korean barbecue, we got, like, a little group together, and we, like, got lunch before the show a

[00:51:00] little

[00:51:00] bit of

[00:51:01] Jeff Sieh: like showed up for it? Like, I mean, is it like, did you have to get like a concert hall? I think what, I mean,

[00:51:06] Eden Liu: yeah so it was at the racket in New York I don’t know the final headcount I know we had over a hundred people at the show

[00:51:13] Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

[00:51:14] Eden Liu: yeah it was at the racket NYC it was like Just like a little, a little mini stage, like a very, it’s a small venue, but like, very, like, there’s a DJ booth. And so like, there’s like also graphics being played on the screen.

[00:51:27] Um, my favorite segment is when the, there’s a movie podcast, Cinephobe. On the podcast network where we did a trivia segment. And we had like people from the community, from, from the audience come up on stage and answer trivia questions, which I thought was just like sort of taking the community engagement to like the next level beyond just like being in the same room with people.

[00:51:46] You’re actually giving them an opportunity to like be involved in the show itself.

[00:51:50] Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

[00:51:50] That’s brilliant.

[00:51:51] Eden Liu: that was sort of like the overarching experience. It was really, really amazing.

[00:51:56] Jeff Sieh: I, I think it’s brilliant because you’re taking people offline and meeting them, you know, in person and cementing that relationship. And that just, you know, and then when you go back into your, your, your show or whatever. I mean, there are people in the comments right now that I met at Momentum and they show up every week.

[00:52:10] Like Kira’s here, uh, some other people, Corey is here. I mean, and those are people who I actually sat down with at those live events. And

[00:52:16] Eden Liu: Yes. Thank you for joining us. Yo, so that’s the thing, is like, if you think about it, all of the community building prior to live shows was all done online. It’s through social media, like Twitter and IG, or like, you know, just podcast reviews. Like, you know, these are like, people that you only know as like their internet avatars.

[00:52:37] And like, when you get to like, chop it up in person with these people, you know, like online interactions, You know, like, it’s asking a question, it’s a CTA, it’s a hook, you know, but like when it’s in person, you’re literally just like hanging out and like topics of conversation pop up that you would never have intentionally over the internet, or it’s like you’re getting a drink and like you find out someone always orders an old fashioned now, you know, like, it’s like these little tiny things about hanging out with people that you just like would not usually get from, you Interacting with them online, that just really strengthens those relationships like so much more.

[00:53:18] Like it’s just these are become real people in your life now. A a couple of, one of my, like my best friends are people that I met at live shows of the podcast, especially when I was first starting out. Like it’s, it’s pretty incredible and like, just to feel when someone tells you that, like they listen to your show every single week, that they love the show.

[00:53:38] They remember a specific take that you, you gave that they. all so much for joining me today, and I will see you in the next one. Bye! Bye! Bye! Bye!

[00:54:01] Jeff Sieh: but they, they, they, they, they’re there every

[00:54:02] Eden Liu: Bye! Bye! Bye! Bye! Even if you’re just offering a space to hang out, the podcast that we do is very unserious and even just, like, with Camo office hours, people have said, like, I don’t even have a question, I’m just here to hang out and I’m like, yo, that’s awesome!

[00:54:19] You’re just here to hang out because, like,

[00:54:21] because you can,

[00:54:22] Jeff Sieh: I’m sure people now are wanting the first Camo Live event to come out, like, for you to do. That would be, you know, there’s something about the smaller conferences, and Connor and I have talked about this, is that it’s more intimate, and that’s why we love, like, Lou caps it at, like, 50, I think, people, and, like, Ecamm’s Creator Camp is capped at, like, you know, 100, because it, it, it, it’s very intimate, and you can, as a speaker, it makes me, I can help people.

[00:54:44] Like, instead of getting on the stage at a big place, and then going off, and whatever, and, you know, I’m talking to, you know, a handful of people waiting for you in the halls. Being there and doing, like, table talks and, like, getting in with them deep into stuff. Man, that, that gives you such a good feeling because you’re actually, you see the results that are happening.

[00:55:00] So, yeah, don’t, don’t, uh, badmouth the smaller conferences because some of the best stuff happens there. Um, speaking of the man, the myth, the legend, James Hick. Uh, it’s common in, uh, saying truth. Yeah, we were talking about your great, uh, interview with Eden earlier in the show, James. So, uh, we’ll have to chat later about all this.

[00:55:14] So, um, and then lastly, Rich Watts, the amazing Rich Watts says, Hi, all. Been here for the full hour soaking in this great discussion. Couldn’t agree more about the value of connections and community. They are often the birth of great things that come later. That is a perfect way to end the show. We are actually over.

[00:55:30] Eden, thank you

[00:55:31] Eden Liu: Oh wow, I didn’t

[00:55:32] even

[00:55:32] Jeff Sieh: you, yeah, this is, it’s so much fun. So this is, you, so much great value. Tell everybody where they can find you, what you got going on, all your social stuff, and let people know where to find you.

[00:55:41] Eden Liu: Um, my personal socials are at PikachuLiu, that is Pikachu spelled like the Pokemon L I U after it. Um, I’m also behind a lot of camo socials at reincubate, at camoapp on YouTube. I am all over the YouTube channel. Come hang out with me on one of our Office Hours live streams.

[00:55:57] Jeff Sieh: Awesome. The amazing, unsinkable Connor Brown. We’re thinking, can they find out about all the stuff that Connor has to offer?

[00:56:03] Conor Brown: All the stuff I got going on, you can go to vacationkingdoms. com and you can follow us at vacationkingdoms across the social medias. Great show today. Be sure to follow Pikachu Liu. Love that. Love that username.

[00:56:17] Jeff Sieh: and next week we have the amazing Mike Russell, who does music, creative, but is deep into AI. So it’s going to be an all AI show, which will be so much fun. So make sure you guys stop and check that out. I’m excited to have that. I thank you guys for watching. Thank you, George, for watching. Brusco, Corey, Eden, you’re just commenting even on your own show at the same time.

[00:56:36] You’re just a multitasker. Cara is here as well. Thank you guys so much for watching. Uh, thank you to our sponsors, Ecamm, ecamm. com forward slash Jeff. Save 30 percent on your first purchase. we’ll see you guys next week. Bye, everybody.

[00:56:47] Eden Liu: bye, everyone.