đź”” We’re thrilled to have Mike Allton join us to discuss “Redefining Podcasts: The Zero-Listen Strategy.”

Discover how the revolutionary concept of zero-listen podcasts can transform your content strategy, leveraging the power of podcasts for marketing, education, and beyond.

Prepare for an enlightening episode full of insights and innovative ideas that will reshape how you think about content creation! 🚀 

Zero Listen Podcasts: Driving Business Results Through Strategic Podcasting

Introduction: The Emergence of Zero Listen Podcasts

Alright, folks, lean in because we’re about to dive into something that sounds a bit out there, but stick with me—it’s going to be worth it. Have you ever heard of a Zero Listen Podcast? Yeah, it threw me for a loop too. But, as it turns out, this concept is nothing short of a secret weapon in the world of marketing. Coined by the insightful A. Lee Judge, this strategy flips the script on what we traditionally consider successful in the podcasting universe.

So, what’s the deal with Zero Listen Podcasts? In a nutshell, it’s about leveraging podcasts as a powerful tool to drive your business forward—think generating leads and creating resources for your sales and marketing team. And here’s the kicker: it’s not about how many ears catch your show. Instead, it’s about the strategic impact your podcast can have behind the scenes, through building relationships and trust.

Key Takeaway: The primary goal of a Zero Listen podcast is to leverage the podcast to strengthen relationships, generate leads, and drive business outcomes such as sales and subscriptions.

The Strategic Thinking Behind Zero Listen Podcasts

Alright, team, let’s get down to the brass tacks of why Zero Listen Podcasts are shaking things up in the marketing world. Now, if you’re anything like me, the idea of a podcast not sweating over how many folks tune in sounds a bit like hosting a party and not caring if anyone shows up. But here’s the twist—what if your ‘party’ is more about making a few meaningful connections rather than filling the room? That’s where the genius of Zero Listen Podcasts comes into play.

Two Roads Diverged in a Wood…And I Took the One Less Traveled by

When we talk podcasts, we’ve got two camps. First, there’s the traditional kind where success is measured by downloads, listens, and how many people you can get to press play. This is great for creators looking to make a splash, grow an audience, or even monetize directly through sponsorships and ads.

Then, we’ve got the road less traveled: Zero Listen Podcasts. These aren’t about the numbers game. Instead, they’re all about leveraging the podcast format as a dynamic tool to drive real-deal business results. Think less about how many listens and more about getting the right guests.

Why B2B Marketers Should be Sitting Up and Paying Attention

For my B2B pals out there, this is where it gets interesting. Zero Listen Podcasts are like a secret handshake in the world of business marketing. They’re specially crafted to drive not just any results, but the ones that count—sales, leads, and those all-important business connections. It’s about quality over quantity, my friends.

Imagine this: each episode is a golden opportunity to chat with potential partners or dream clients. Instead of cold calling, you’re warm inviting—getting them on your show to share insights. This isn’t just content creation; it’s relationship building, networking, and yes, even sales strategy, all rolled into one.

Crafting Conversations That Count

The real magic happens in how you frame these conversations. It’s not just chit-chat; it’s a carefully crafted dialogue designed to open doors, explore opportunities, and set the stage for what comes next. Each question, each topic, is chosen not just for its face value but for its potential to lead to those positive outcomes we’re all chasing after.

In the world of Zero Listen Podcasts, success isn’t measured by the applause of a crowd but by the nod of a key player who’s ready to talk business. By inviting the right guests and steering the conversation towards mutual goals and challenges, you’re laying down the groundwork for partnerships and projects that could redefine your business.

And just like that, we peel back the curtain on the strategic thinking behind Zero Listen Podcasts. It’s about tuning into a frequency where every guest is a potential partner and every conversation is a step toward your business goals.

Practical Advice for Leveraging Zero Listen Podcasts ​

So how do you make this strategy work for you? Well, buckle up, because I’ve got some golden nuggets of advice from Mike that are going to help you leverage this approach like a pro.

The Guest Experience: Rolling Out the Red Carpet

First things first, your guests are your MVPs. Your number one goal? Make them look good—scratch that—make them look great. This isn’t just about having a friendly chat; it’s about creating a platform where your guests can truly showcase their expertise, insights, and unique value. Think of it as setting the stage for their TED Talk moment.

Every guest is unique, and your approach should be too. While you can have a few go-to questions in your back pocket, tailoring the conversation to each guest’s expertise ensures you’re not just scratching the surface—you’re mining for diamonds. Think of each question as a carefully chosen tool designed to chip away at the ordinary, revealing the extraordinary beneath. Instead of asking, “What’s your professional background?” try, “What moment in your career truly defined the path you’re on today?” These questions don’t just get answers; they invite your guest to share the narrative essence of their journey. 

Scripting and Preparing for Podcast Interviews

To script or not to script, that is the question. And the answer? Mike Allton says a little bit of both. Script those intros, questions, and segues to keep things on track, but leave room for those spontaneous moments of gold. And always, always share your plan with your guests—especially in the B2B world, where the legal and PR gods must be appeased.

Mike implements a detailed onboarding process that does more than just gather the basics like preferred headshots, bios, and links. It delves deeper, asking guests pivotal questions right from the start, such as ‘What’s something you want to teach our audience?’ This not only ensures that each episode is aligned with business objectives—like gaining insights into a target market (the guest) —but also guarantees the production of valuable content. Through this meticulously designed process, Mike ensures that every podcast episode serves dual purposes: achieving strategic business goals while simultaneously delivering content that is educational and enriching. 

The Ultimate Guest Goodie Bag

After the mic goes off, the magic continues. Mike recommends whipping up a packet of content for your guests—clips for their social media, stunning quote graphics, the full podcast episode, and maybe even a “thank you” note. It’s like giving them a goodie bag after a killer party. They get to relive the highlights and share their star moment with their audience, spreading the love (and your brand) far and wide.

Unlocking Sales Potential with Every Episode

Here’s where it gets really juicy. Your podcast isn’t just content; it’s a powerhouse sales tool. Use those insightful conversations to fuel your ads, pinpoint your targeting, and arm your sales team with killer resources. Think of each episode as a Swiss Army knife, ready to tackle different facets of your marketing and sales strategy.

Zero Listen Podcasts redefine traditional success metrics, focusing instead on fostering relationships and driving business growth. By inviting potential partners and customers as guests, they create a unique space for relationship building. This isn’t just networking; it’s crafting a foundation for trust, collaboration, and future sales opportunities through meaningful dialogue.

Framing Solutions Within Stories

Interviews are subtly designed to illuminate the problems your products or services solve, blending your solutions into the conversation. This strategic approach not only highlights your value proposition but also piques interest among listeners and guests alike, drawing attention to what you offer.

Empowering Sales with Rich Content

The generated content, whether it’s clips, blog posts, or social media shares, arms your sales team with tangible examples and narratives to engage prospects effectively. This resource-rich arsenal aids in addressing client concerns and showcases real-world applications of your offerings.

Extending Reach Through Targeted Promotion

Utilizing podcast content in targeted advertising campaigns can significantly amplify your reach. By focusing on specific audiences, Zero Listen Podcasts serve as a lead generation tool, drawing in potential customers from your target market and funneling them into your sales pipeline.

Repurpose Like a Content Recycling Ninja

Don’t stop at just a podcast episode. Chop it up, mix it around, and voilà—you’ve got social media clips, engaging blog posts, dynamic videos, and so much more. It’s about squeezing every drop of value out of your content and making sure it reaches every corner of your audience’s world.

Leveraging Social Proof for Brand Amplification

As this diversified content circulates, especially when shared by your guests, it lends invaluable social proof to your brand. This endorsement, akin to a seal of trust, not only enhances your credibility but also attracts new potential customers and leads from untapped audience segments. The ripple effect of each share translates into organic growth, community engagement, and invaluable credibility for your brand.

Bringing It All Home: The Power of Zero Listen Podcasts

By focusing on business outcomes rather than listener numbers, businesses can integrate Zero-Listen podcasts into their marketing mix to achieve significant results. In shifting towards more outcome-oriented podcasting businesses are empowered to unlock a treasure trove of opportunities—from building deeper relationships and establishing social proof to enhancing sales enablement and driving targeted advertising efforts.

As we wrap up, remember that stepping into the world of Zero Listen Podcasts is about embracing a mindset of strategic content creation and relationship building. And to help you navigate this journey, don’t forget to grab Mike Alltons Marketing Strategy Workbook here. Use the code “freebeard” to get it free.


This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

[00:00:00] Jeff Sieh: Hello folks, welcome to Social Media News Live.

[00:00:01] I’m Jeff Sieh. And you’re not.

[00:00:04] Conor Brown: I’m Connor Brown, and this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the world of social media and more.

[00:00:11] Jeff Sieh: Have you ever heard of a zero listen podcast? Are you wondering maybe how this concept can shape the future of your marketing? Now, I hadn’t heard of it before, and I was certainly intrigued. So today we are delighted to host an expert who’s not only familiar with this innovative approach, but has also implemented Successfully, Mike Alton is going to share his journey of discovering Zero Listen Podcasts, the strategic thinking behind them, and practical advice for leveraging this method in your marketing mix.

[00:00:40] So prepare to uncover the potential of Zero Listen Podcasts to transform your content strategy. So sit back, clear your schedule, clear your mind, and get ready for this week’s episode of Social Media News Live. Mike Alton, how you doing today, my friend?

[00:00:55] Mike Allton: Great. I am Jeff Sieh’s BBF as I was introduced earlier today. That was, that was new to me.

[00:01:01] Jeff Sieh: Before Beardfriend. Mike is one of those. I think you and Peg Fitzpatrick and I think maybe even Dustin might have fallen to that BBF category. So, yeah, it was back in the day. I’m so excited. If you guys don’t know who Mike is, you probably have never been on the interwebs before, but you should really get to know him.

[00:01:17] He is a fractional CMO, an international keynote speaker, an author at the Social Media Hat, and Head of Strategic Partnerships at Agora Pulse, where he strengthens relationships, with Social Media Educators, Influencers, and Partner Brands. He has spent over a decade in digital marketing and brings an unparalleled level of experience and excitement to the fore, whether he’s delivering a presentation or leading a workshop.

[00:01:42] Once again, Mike, this is going to be awesome. I’m really interested because when I said, Hey Mike, what do you want to talk about on the show? And he said, Hey, let’s talk about Zero Listen Podcast. I’m like, Okay, I didn’t want to look stupid so I did Google it, but I don’t feel too bad because there’s only one other thing I could find about it because I had never heard about it before, but this is going to be, be a lot of fun.

[00:02:01] Mike Allton: Yeah. So right off the bat, I want to give a huge shoutout to A. Lee Judge. This is his term. He coined it. I have learned from him. It’s something I was actually doing and didn’t know there was a word for it, a phrase. So when it popped in my inbox a couple of weeks ago, I was like, yes, that’s it. This is what I’m doing.

[00:02:18] So yeah, I’m excited to talk about it, but definitely total credit to Lee, for the phrase Zero Listen Podcast.

[00:02:24] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. It is a great, it’s very, it makes you want to click and find out more about it, so that’s why we used it. I do wanna do a shout out because, you know, we use this as a podcast. We also, it’s a live video and we’re using e camm and they sponsor the show. And I wanna give a big shout out. You can go to ecamm.com/jeff, use code Jeff 15, you say 15% on your first purchase, but some cool things they just released version 4.2 this Monday, and now you have Instagram live.

[00:02:52] Go right into it and actually pull in comments from Instagram Live, which I don’t know of another tool that does that. it’s got a vertical safe zone, so you can go there. They have scenery. video integration, where you can actually edit your videos. And also they have a now, updated virtual camera. So you can actually use the virtual camera in Ecamm on your FaceTime calls.

[00:03:11] It’s built into your Mac now. So Discord, Keynote, all those things now work with that virtual camera, which is really, really handy. So. Make sure you check them out, ecamm. com forward slash Jeff. All right, now for this Zero Listen podcast, Mike, this was just really, really fascinating. I really want you to explain this concept of Zero Listen podcast, and it’s how you’re using it primarily for your business.

[00:03:38] Mike Allton: Yeah. So The way I like to think about it is that there are really two different kinds of podcasts and podcasters. The traditional podcast, if you think of, you know, big names like Joe Rogan and many others, they’re driving their show based on how many people actually consume that podcast content.

[00:03:56] They’re listening, they’re downloading, they’re subscribing, and they’re monetizing through sponsorships, just like we just listened to a great sponsorship of Ecamm. That’s a lot of the ways that those kinds of people are promoting their shows as a vehicle for reaching those individuals. And that’s great.

[00:04:13] There’s nothing wrong with that. But if you are particularly in the B2B space and you’re not creating a podcast just to drive listens, you’re creating a podcast because you want to drive actual business results, sell a product, Gain leads and sales and subscribers and those kinds of things of your actual service.

[00:04:31] The zero listen podcast strategy basically says, look, our goals have nothing to do with listenership of the audio podcast. If people listen, that’s great. It’s not that it’s not that we don’t want listeners, but that’s not the primary purpose. The primary purpose is to use the podcast as a vehicle to drive these other business results.

[00:04:49] And so that can look like a lot of different things. And we’ll dig into this in a little bit. But what I really want you to take away from this is that the podcast now becomes. A vehicle for driving business results. It has to fit into your overall marketing strategy. So there’s going to be a lot of other things that happen that we’re maybe going to focus on, but an easy example might be where let’s say Connor here is actually one of my target ICPs.

[00:05:13] I want to sell to Connor. I want to sell to people just like him, and I want to sell to him specifically. So I’m going to invite him on the show. As a guest, because quite frankly, inviting somebody to be a guest in your podcast is typically a lot easier than to get them to say yes to a demo or a sales call.

[00:05:31] So I get Connor on the podcast and I’m developing a relationship with him. I’m matching and mirroring him and I’m building rapport during the interview and I’m asking him questions and getting him to know him during the interview. And now after the interview, a couple of things have happened. First of all, we’ve developed that rapport.

[00:05:46] So he’s gotten to know, like, and trust me a little bit. I’ve made him look good. And after that call, we can potentially take the conversation even further. I mean, you and I both know, Jeff, a lot of the best conversations happening when we’re not actually recording either before the interview or after the interview.

[00:06:02] And so often as hosts, we’re like, and we’ve been doing this for many years. We’re like, gosh, I wish I would have recorded that segment. The same thing can happen with a zero listen podcast. And that’s just one of the things that you can do with them.

[00:06:14] Jeff Sieh: So it’s funny you mention this, I have a friend who actually, He started his podcasting business by doing that. He would go interview SaaS companies and, you know, he was trying to get hired for being, you know, working with them as a marketing guy. And what ended up happening, he actually started making, he now offers podcasting services for SaaS people to make those connections.

[00:06:35] They don’t really care, like you said, podcast strategy that they’re getting tons of downloads. They want to be introduced to other people in their markets that they can form partnerships with and stuff like that. And he’s now created an entire. So, I just think it’s super intriguing.

[00:06:52] Mike Allton: Yeah. And this is something I, like I said, I’ve been doing for two years. I didn’t know that there was a phrase for it until he came along. I was like, Oh yeah, that’s exactly what I was doing with my partnership unpacked podcast.

[00:07:06] Jeff Sieh: It’s a great podcast, by the way.

[00:07:08] Conor Brown: Love it. So I think, you know, too, it’s, it’s a strategy of, of how you’re going to do it, how you’re going to talk to someone, right, of building those relationships and, and things like that. But Mike, from, from a content creation perspective, and then also utility perspective, how does this differ from a traditional.

[00:07:26] Like you said, an audience focused podcast. but the setup of it, and then I guess how you use this down the road too.

[00:07:36] Mike Allton: From an initial setup perspective, to my knowledge, it’s essentially the same. I’m obviously not Joe Rogan. I’ve never had a big podcast, where I’m driving, you know, just tons of listenerships. But. From what I know, from what I’ve done, the initial setup is the same. You’re going to decide what your podcast is going to look like, sound like, what you’re going to talk about, who you’re trying to talk to, and you’re going to start to reach out to guests and you’re going to interview them, whether it’s live or recorded, and then you’re going to push that out to the podcast channels.

[00:08:03] Where the real differentiator I think is, is then what happens next. With a traditional podcast, you promote the shows and you repurpose them, and we’ll get into that. But the, the focus is on having people listen to the podcast content. With the zero listen strategy, that’s not really the focus. We’ll promote the podcast.

[00:08:22] Sure. We’ll try and get some listens. Absolutely. But we first and foremost want to spend time up front researching those guests and making sure that we’re framing the conversation and we’re asking questions that are going to lead to positive outcomes. Additional conversations and potential business goals.

[00:08:40] Easy example. Again, I’m going to pick on you, Connor. If I was interviewing you and I wanted to do business with you, I might make sure that one of the questions that I ask you during our interview has to do with some of the things that we solve in my business. Like, if I’m interviewing you for Agorapulse, right, I might talk to you about, you know, how are you managing social media today, and what are some of the struggles that, that, that you’re facing?

[00:09:02] Just kind of an open question, and I don’t really care how you answer, but I’m going to listen to your answer. And then after the show, I’m going to say, kind of, that was fantastic. You, you were a great guest, and if maybe you don’t do a lot of podcast interviews, like maybe your target audience probably aren’t really doing a lot of podcasting, they might be a little nervous.

[00:09:19] Coming into the podcast, it might be their first time being interviewed, right? So that’s an opportunity for you as the host to really make them feel fantastic. Conor, you were fantastic. I really loved your answers. And remember when I asked you about how you were managing social media and you talked about how you were pretty happy with the tool that you were using, but you were using a spreadsheet to create UTM parameters and try and track all that stuff.

[00:09:38] And it wasn’t working very well and you’re spending a lot of time. And you know, what if I could show you a tool that actually has that built in and you don’t have to use a. Spreadsheet, and you don’t have to worry about it ever happening. Was that something you’d be interested in? I’ve, I’ve basically sold him on Agorapulse by framing the question up front and then responding after the call.

[00:09:59] And the funny thing is, is they set it on video, on recording. They can’t go back and say, no, I’m not really struggling with that. They said it, you’ve got it. So that’s one thing that you can do is right. You can frame the podcast right up front and frame those questions. The other thing you’re going to want to do is use the actual material that you create differently.

[00:10:17] We’ll talk about all the different ways that you can repurpose in a moment, but from a utilization perspective, it’s about putting that content in the hands of your sales team, your product marketing team, using it to drive ads to the rest of your target audience. I’ll be a hundred percent transparent here to Gora Paul.

[00:10:32] So one of the audiences we’re, Targeting right now is, is social media managers who work for retail brands. So we’re spinning up a whole new podcast to talk to those people. And I’m interviewing those kinds of people. And so the front part of that strategy is, is absolutely spot on. I’m going to be bringing on those exact social media managers to talk to them on the podcast and, and see how they’re doing social media today with their retail brands.

[00:10:54] But then we’re also going to take that content and we’re going to advertise it to the other people that we’re targeting in that same ICP, in that same target list and make ourselves aware. To that audience through the content that we’re creating.

[00:11:08] Jeff Sieh: That’s really cool. So, one of the things that I think, you know, because you and I have been both involved in the podcasting, like, way back into Google there you go again, Chris. the, The thing is, you know, we’ve listened to podcasts about podcasting and everything is about the numbers.

[00:11:26] It’s all about getting those numbers and, and it’s, it’s almost a mind shift, but like Some of it happens organically and like you mentioned before not being able to actually you know We put a name on it like the zero listen strategy, but I know like Chris Stone He does a lot of editing, you know videos and remote production And now he’s because he does such a good job with that and he’s had guests on they’re like Hey, can you do my show?

[00:11:47] And so I think a lot of it’s kind of been organic, but we really haven’t been strategic about this So what kind of? You know, we, we kind of touched a little bit on repurposing, but what are some of those key strategies that you recommend for like transforming when a podcast is done into all these different multiple content types?

[00:12:05] Cause you’ve been, I mean, you have done that for your blog for years and now you’re doing it kind of with podcasts. So what are some of those key strategies that, okay, I’m done. I still want to do this zero listen strategy, but I also want to make my guests look good. What kind of, you know, content can I create out of it?

[00:12:21] Mike Allton: Yeah. So first we’ll talk about it from the guest perspective. And again, a lot of podcasters are already doing this. You interview me, we have a great show after the interview and you’re done with the editing, you might send me a packet or an email. Thanks Mike, for being on the show, you know, here’s the podcast and that sort of thing.

[00:12:37] You want to make sure with this particular podcast, you go as heavy into this as you can. You are absolutely going to send them a thank you note. You’re actually going to send them, you are absolutely going to send them a packet that has. Multiple Clips, Suggested Social Posts, Quote Graphics. Here’s the blog post.

[00:12:54] Here’s the podcast. Here’s the YouTube video. You want to make sure that all of that is included and you, and you don’t, I don’t wanna say half ass it, but you know, a lot of people don’t really go to the ends of the earth to make sure that all those things are included, but that’s a big part of the strategy because we want to make sure that these people know how good we made them look and have an opportunity to share it with their audience.

[00:13:15] And this is where the strategy takes off a little bit because those are the people that are already connected with more of your target audience, right? They’re already friends with other people just like them working in other businesses. So we definitely want them sharing to LinkedIn, to Instagram, to TikTok, maybe even opportunities for them to show off how good they looked and the smart things that they said on your show because these clips are going to be all about Them, how they solve their problems.

[00:13:43] Even if your tool or solution was part of that. No, they’re the hero, make them the hero in these clips. That’s the first part of the strategy. The second part of the strategy is sales enablement. Whether you’ve got a full blown sales team with a sales enablement manager or not, you can empower your sales team to have this kind of information because you’re talking to people who are solving the same kinds of problems that all the rest of your targeting audience is.

[00:14:10] And again, whether your solution is mentioned in those conversations or not, your sales team is going to be talking to people who in the course of those conversations are going to bring up things like, yeah, I have problems, you know, keeping on, on top of permissions, or I have problems with storage or whatever it is that your solution solves for, and you can create great content that helps answer that And address a lot of those questions.

[00:14:34] And again, this is where you need to make sure that you’re doing everything that you possibly can, because again, a normal podcaster puts out the podcast, the publish the show notes, make a couple of clips, you need to go further, you need to make sure that you’ve got a blog post with a full transcript, maybe push that into a PDF.

[00:14:51] Talk to your sales team and find out how are they typically communicating with their prospects? Are they sharing one pagers, PDFs, workbooks? What is it? What, how are they sharing content? Is it YouTube? Is it short clips? Is it long clips? Have it all and then put all that into some kind of a system or repository, whether it’s an Airtable database or a sheet that they can quickly go to.

[00:15:15] It’s as if they’re talking to a prospect and the prospect says, Hey, I’m having an issue with this. Whatever this is, they might not necessarily have your entire Rolodex of podcasts in their brain. The salesperson, they can’t, they’ve got enough on their plate. You want to make it super easy for them to go someplace and do a quick search.

[00:15:32] You know, who else has, you know, had this kind of an issue, just a keyword search and come up with the list of the resources that you’ve already made available. And the good news is with today’s tools, it might sound like I’m talking about a lot of work. I’m not. We all know, thanks to AI and this proliferation of tools, there’s, there’s so many options available today that can really streamline and virtually automate most of what I’m talking about.

[00:15:59] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. So, just, and that’s what we do. Like, so, after the show’s done, the first thing it does goes up to the script, and we chop it up, and we have templates in there, and then my daughter actually takes it, and, and we use the Girl Pulse, and we’re actually able to, we, like I was telling Mike before, I think we have, And we have buckets for each different social network.

[00:16:17] And I think we have like 250 clips that constantly rotate. And Mike was making fun of that. Like, yeah, once a month I get tagged on it. But if you’ve noticed all those clips and, and. I was strategic by accident, which is my life, but, but, I always make it about my guests. Like you’ll rarely see my face on there.

[00:16:35] It’s mostly about my guests, which allows me to get great guests. And they also share that stuff. They love seeing it. And so when I ask them to come back on my show, they know that I’m going to do that for them and make them, like you said, the hero. So I think that’s a really good way. To do the repurposing thing.

[00:16:51] You know, we all see a lot of those influence out there that just seemed to always be talking about themselves. And, you know, even on their podcast, you know, they’re just waiting to talk. You know, they’re, they’re waiting. I didn’t hear what you said, but I’m going to say something that’s going to promote me.

[00:17:05] And. That’s not what works on this kind of strategy is what I’m hearing.

[00:17:09] Mike Allton: Yeah. Yeah. Cause this, the whole podcast is not about you. Ever. It’s not, it’s not even about your brand. cause again, most of the time you’re going to be talking, if you do this strategy, right, you’re talking to people who aren’t customers yet. So there’s not going to be a lot of conversation about your brand or solution, cause they just don’t know it.

[00:17:26] They can’t. And that’s fine. That’s not the point. You can work that in. I mean, one of the things that I do, another trick is that I bake in my, intro, my outro and my, my mid roll video when I’m recording, I don’t, I don’t have those edited in. So the guest. Watches those right along with me, right along with the audience, right?

[00:17:48] They watch the intro and the outro. Exactly. The mid roll is a commercial. It’s almost always about Agorapulse. It’s almost always a testimonial. Like we have our weekly webinar, the Martech show. So we just aired this past week on Wednesday, and we were talking with Chase Buckner from High Levels.

[00:18:06] Fantastic conversation, and right in the middle of it, we were talking about marketing automation. So right in the middle of it, I played a minute and a half testimonial from Stony Creek, marketing agency about how they use Agorapulse, and how they use it for marketing automation, and responding to comments, all that kind of thing.

[00:18:24] So Chase had to sit there and watch, and I’m not necessarily using Chase as an example of a target. I’ve been a fan of Mitch Joel. I’ve been a fan of his podcast. Mitch Joel was a great example. I don’t want to pick on Mitch, but I was interviewing Mitch. He’s a fantastic guest. I mean, if you can get Mitch on your show, do it.

[00:18:44] But I have not had a long time relationship with him. With Mitch, you know, I’ve known each other, but we’ve never done a lot of work together. I was quite frankly thrilled and a little shocked that he agreed to come on the show. And so halfway through the interview, I’m playing this mid roll ad about Agorapulse.

[00:19:00] I know he’s never looked at Agorapulse. I know we’d never talked about it. So he’s watching that. And the way I’ve got my show set up is I play that and then I segue into the next question. He stopped me. And so some of the effect of, wow, that was a really interesting, little, little snippet you play there.

[00:19:16] I should give a Gorepulse a look. That’s like, yes,

[00:19:20] Jeff Sieh: That’s

[00:19:20] Mike Allton: yes, you should.

[00:19:22] Jeff Sieh: That’s a genius strategy, by the way. I, I never thought about putting that in front of your clients in that way, by pre baking it in, that’s really, really cool. Right.

[00:19:30] Conor Brown: is that the main success metric that, that you’re going for, Mike? Cause. You know, in a traditional podcast, it’s, it’s how many downloads am I getting? How many listens? If it’s a video, what’s my watch time at, right? And then maybe, you know, are people clicking my affiliate links from, from that tangentially, but it is that metric of, you know, what I’m going to look into this tool is, is that the kind of the sole metric when it comes to a, a zero listen podcast?

[00:20:01] Mike Allton: This is one of the challenges for this strategy because in marketing overall, we like to have that North star KPI. You’ll hear that all the time, right? That one thing that’s really most important that we’re going to obsess over that metric. And, and that’s great. If you can get that in this strategy, that’s typically going to end up being a disappointment because what.

[00:20:19] You really trying to do is accomplish about eight different things with each one of these shows, getting the individual guests. To raise their hand and say, yeah, I’d like to take out your, check out your tool or solution or whatever it is that you’re offering a hundred percent. That is a metric that you’re going to track.

[00:20:35] In fact, what you need to do is bake in a way to make sure that your guests are being tracked in your CRM, just like any other prospect that raised your hand. Not that you necessarily want to start nurturing them as soon as they come on your show, because they did not sign up for that. But if you’ve got a great CRM, like HubSpot or Salesforce, something like that, you’re tracking each time.

[00:20:54] A prospect consumes a piece of content. Did they attend a webinar? Did they read a blog post? Did they sign up for a trial? Those kinds of things. Being a guest on a podcast needs to now be part of that. So you got to work with your, your rev ops team or your marketing ops team, or figure it out yourself if you don’t have a team.

[00:21:11] So those are the things that you want to look at. Absolutely. Did they go on to sign up for a free trial or a demo on their own? Absolutely. There’s also the sales enablement piece, right? How much content were you able to create for your marketing department, for your product marketing department, and for your sales team?

[00:21:27] How much traction did that content get? Well, we might not get a lot of listens on the podcast itself, The blog post that is created as a result of the podcast, that might get a lot of search traffic. So you want to pay attention to that. That might end up driving some trials or demos or, or signups, whatever it is that you’re tracking as a business metric. And then how often is the sales team actually able to use? That content in the pursuit of those other goals. And then finally, I mentioned earlier, you should be using this as part of your advertising and paid media strategy. You can use this content in spots or newsletters. You can cross promote on other podcasts.

[00:22:06] I’m joining Jason Falls Marketing Podcast Network so that I can get these podcasts in front of other. Marketing, podcast listeners, right? There’s the target audience there. So each one of these metrics, I would hate to just pick one because I would be afraid that the results are going to be rather small from just one.

[00:22:28] Now, when you take them on the whole, we would expect to see a lot of overall success, but it’s going to be hard to merge them into a single metric,

[00:22:34] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, because a lot of people were like, oh, I heard your, I heard you talking with Mike Alton on the podcast. It was really interesting. You know, I’ve got a, you know, I would love to check out your service or how you’d be on your show or whatever it is. I mean, there’s so many different ways and, you know, the key, like you were saying, is tracking those things.

[00:22:50] The other thing earlier, Mike, you said was, you know, Make it easy for the guests to share it. Like you kind of, we kind of glossed over it a little bit, but the podcast that I love to be on is when they give me swipe copy and they have, they already have had asked for my headshot or whatever, and they already give me the graphics and I can just send it out.

[00:23:06] Now, they need to be good, because I’ve also had ones that have been sent to me, and I’m like, I can’t share that on my channel. Like, it’s that bad. You know, you’ve, we’ve all been there, like, I’m sorry, but, you know, and that’s awkward to do, but make sure, you know, it’s, there’s some great Canva templates. I mean, you can just, it’s, it’s not that hard to put together.

[00:23:24] So, yeah, I thought it was really, really

[00:23:27] Mike Allton: I do that every week, I’ll be honest. I mean, I’ve got a video team that’s creating nice, polished, repurposed clips from the Martech show and all of our content, but every single Wednesday with the Martech show, my very first segment, we spend like three or four minutes, my host Robin Diamond and I, dishing about something new.

[00:23:45] In tech, like a couple of weeks ago, it was NVIDIA this week. It was Apple and people were talking about how there might be an Apple ring coming and how that might tie into certain things. So we spent a couple of minutes talking about that. So as soon as it shows over, that’s timely information. I don’t want to wait for my video team to catch up.

[00:24:01] I take out that clip, I splice it, I put it into a Canva template that I already spent time creating. and then I pushed that into Descript so I can add some nice, captions. And I push that out to all my channels. So that goes out later that afternoon, every single week.

[00:24:17] Conor Brown: So Jeff, I’m going to go down a rabbit hole.

[00:24:19] Jeff Sieh: Go for it. Ha,

[00:24:20] Conor Brown: So when I’ve learned from the best. So when it comes to this, I know you said that like the show you were just talking about every Wednesday, but it. Is this different from a traditional podcast when it comes to scheduling? Because with a, you know, a podcast where we’re focused on downloads and listens, consistency in scheduling is key, whether it’s monthly, weekly, bi weekly, whatever it is.

[00:24:45] For me, this sounds more like it’s on the guest, right? We want the right guest producing the right content. We have so much stuff we have to do on the back end. Once it’s published, get up a blog post, all these other things, Is it less about like a consistent schedule and more, let’s get the right person on the right episode so we can create the right content afterward?

[00:25:07] Mike Allton: That’s a great question, Connor. And you’re absolutely right. From a podcast audience perspective, I would say, yeah, the schedule really probably doesn’t matter because you’re not expecting or trying to have this captive podcast audience that’s always looking for your episodes to drop on Monday mornings. However, if you’ve got a team in place, or even your own business responsibilities, it’s probably still in your best interest that you’ve got a routine and you’re doing this on a regular cadence, whether it’s weekly, bi weekly, monthly, what you decide, whatever it is that you’re going to go after. With my podcast, they all happen to be weekly.

[00:25:45] It doesn’t have to be that way. But I also have a team in place. I also have certain things that I want to meet in terms of objectives and performance metrics. And because we’re also pushing the content out as blog posts and videos and other things that schedule probably does help us probably don’t have that audience looking for it even on the blog, but if you’ve got a content team where There’s also other kinds of blog content that’s going out.

[00:26:14] They’re probably going to want to make sure that they can always count on you to have your transcript and your show notes and your podcast ready to be published as a blog post every single Monday. That way they know they’re putting out their content the rest of the week. And it’s, it’s not kind of a hit or miss thing.

[00:26:30] Jeff Sieh: So one of the things, and I was on, Jim Coulson, his, he has like his own kind of personal fun tech podcast. We were talking about the Apple Vision Pro. Last night, but he works for Gallup and they have a, he is their podcast producer and it’s, they have like six podcasts. I mean, they have their own little network, I mean, little network, but Gallup.

[00:26:50] so he, he does all their stuff, but they’ve seen the power of this. Like they, they don’t call it zero listen because they have tons of listeners, but it’s not just this kind of thing, but what they do, and I know other podcasters do this, they, they have seasons. Have you ever done seasons for your show, Mike?

[00:27:06] And you might want to talk about that a little bit because instead of doing an episodic every week kind of a thing, a lot of businesses do seasons and then they’ll take a little bit of break, maybe catch up and then go to the next one.

[00:27:18] Mike Allton: So my first takeaway there is that Gallup has six shows and therefore they have a podcast network. So I’ve got five shows. So if I,

[00:27:24] Jeff Sieh: You should have

[00:27:24] Mike Allton: I have a podcast network?

[00:27:26] Jeff Sieh: yeah, exactly.

[00:27:27] Conor Brown: b

[00:27:52] Mike Allton: this was going to be season two. I’ve actually put a little bit of a pause on that show because I had to kick off all these other shows.

[00:27:57] I want to revisit it later this year. with the new shows, I’m doing them on seasons by quarter. And what I like about that is it’s an opportunity for us as a brand. It’s a podcaster at the end of the season to do a look back. Who did I talk to? What were some of the trends? What were some of the themes?

[00:28:18] What do I want to change with the upcoming season? Do I want to just create a nice little montage video and talk about who did we have on the show this past season? Who’s coming up next season? My video team did this most amazing montage for me for Partnership Unpacked. I did 50 episodes last year, Partnership Unpacked, and, The, honestly, I don’t say this to brag, but I was just really blessed and thrilled with the logos that I was able to bring on and the guests that I was able to bring on last season.

[00:28:45] So it was really empowering and exciting to see that in a quick montage and to talk about the brands that we’re bringing on this season, like Oracle was already released and some other fantastic solutions. So that’s, Fun. It’s interesting. And it’s also an opportunity for you to revise your targeting and invitation strategy on that regular basis.

[00:29:06] I’m kicking off three new shows right now, which means I’m reaching out to guests right now. I’m asking them to be on the show. And I’ve got zero social proof and all the podcast hosts in the audience are like, yeah, gosh, that’s the worst part. I don’t have an existing host that I can name drop and say, yeah, I’ve talked to Guy Kawasaki.

[00:29:24] I’ve talked to Gary Goldstein, right? I can’t do that yet in a couple of months that will no longer be the case. And yeah, I could just do that on the fly and change that stuff when it occurs. But again, if you do that seasonal approach, Quarterly, monthly, even you can just use that as an opportunity to revisit all of your materials.

[00:29:45] Is it time for me to change my invitation strategy, which would include the text and how I can now bake in some social proof. And I can link to the podcast. Like I, again, I can’t do that now. I was doing that by the middle of last year with the partnership, partnership unpacked, when I approached the leader of partnerships at Oracle, I was able to link to the existing show and he could see it, he was already a listener.

[00:30:05] Strangely enough. But. In a couple months, I’ll be able to do that with the new shows, with the Martech show and the other ones that I’m producing. It’s also an opportunity for you to rethink the branding, the show description, and maybe start to bake in themes. So this is one of the really cool things that you can do if you’re on a seasonal perspective, is think about the topics that you want to talk about in the upcoming season, things that you might not have even thought about when you first launched the show.

[00:30:30] But now that you’ve got for Eight, a dozen episodes under your belt. Those are four, eight or a dozen conversations that you’ve now had with your target audience. And if you’re a thing like me, you don’t know all the target audiences that you potentially have as a business, but once you start to have those conversations, you learn.

[00:30:47] I’ll be transparent. I know marketing agencies really, really well, because I’ve had a lot of conversations with agency owners over the years. I don’t necessarily know social media managers who work for hospitality. That’s an industry. I’m familiar with hospitality. Connor, you’re really familiar with hospitality, right?

[00:31:04] But unless you’ve talked to a lot of social media managers in that space, you might not be familiar with the day to day struggles and challenges and solutions that they’re coming up with. Once I’ve had those conversations and I know the target audience a lot better, I might start to see themes emerge from those conversations and I might realize, you know what, I might want to spend an entire month talking about the seasonality of the use of hospitality, right?

[00:31:30] You know, people are, you know, spring break and Christmas breaks and summer breaks, right? There’s, there’s natural seasons in that industry that are a little less apparent in many other industries like marketing agencies don’t really have that kind of a seasonality in their business. And have an entire series of episodes just talking about, you know, how social media managers in the hospitality, region talk about spring break and how we prepare for it, how we deal with it, how we deal with the aftermath.

[00:31:56] It’s not spring break anymore. What do we do next? There’s all kinds of things that we can talk about and break down that I think that’s that seasonal approach.

[00:32:04] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. That’s fa that’s fascinating. one of the things, and I wanna kinda go back to what Connor asked a little bit about ROI, it, so it’s working for a Agora Pulse. Like there’s a reason that you are putting on more workload on yourself to do five shows, right? Like you started with one or two, and then it’s like, so how did you go to your boss and say, listen, and why are you putting so much emphasis on?

[00:32:31] Because it’s gotta be working. Like, you know, that’s my thing. It’s like it’s. I know people have the struggle and they want to maybe do a podcast for their business or they want to do more podcasting for their business. They may want to be like Jim Coulson and be the podcast guy inside of their marketing arm of their company.

[00:32:47] How do you approach your boss and say, see this is it’s working, here’s what’s working and, and why? how did you do that with like Emmerich at, your polls?

[00:32:57] Mike Allton: Well, honestly, for me, it was a bit of an accident and it started with, yeah, 16, 18 months ago. It was, it was basically late 2022. We had a new CMO at the organization and he wanted the entire organization to have a number of, Shows, webinars, live video streams, podcasts. You want us to be making a lot of noise as an organization.

[00:33:19] And so as a team, we were talking through who could do what, what would make sense. And it occurred to me that I could do a show about partnerships. That’s my a hundred percent of my role at Agorapulse. And within that partnerships umbrella, I could be talking about influencer marketing, brand partnerships, event marketing, co marketing, co selling.

[00:33:37] Oh, there’s all kinds of ways that you can look at partnerships, affiliates even. And I said, well, I can use that. platform of the show to talk about these topics, educate myself. I even say that in the introduction, I specifically say, Hey, this is an opportunity for me to pick the brains of experts in the industry.

[00:33:56] And I used it that way. I would bring people on and I would just. Have them teach me for free on this show.

[00:34:03] Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

[00:34:04] Mike Allton: But I also recognize that it was going to be an opportunity for me to deepen the relationships or even create relationships with new potential partners in ways that I wouldn’t be able to do before.

[00:34:16] You know, as a, as a, as a B2B SaaS company, we can all think of top brands in the space, Slack, Asana, the networks themselves, Meta, TikTok, and so on. And. Often, just like in a sales call, if you approach these folks cold in an email or a LinkedIn and say, Hey, you know, we’d like to partner with you and they’ve never heard of you, they’re probably not going to partner with you.

[00:34:41] But when I approached an individual who leads the agency program for Snapchat and invited him to be on the podcast, He said, Yeah, sure. I’ll be a guest on your podcast. Max Rivera was a fantastic guest on the podcast. And now we’re starting to partner on some other things. And so that was hopefully the start of a great relationship.

[00:35:06] Now, You could almost look at this approach to podcasting as networking. you know, Jeff, you and I have been to Social Media Marketing World many times, and we go always to the, the Hyatt, the Grand Hyatt Bar, which is outside of the event, right? The event’s over in the convention center, but we’re in a hotel next to the convention center before the, the conference, after the conference.

[00:35:31] For networking, to meet our friends, of course, but also to meet the other attendees, other speakers, or people who are running social media or marketing for businesses, it’s networking. And the reason we do it is A, to have fun, of course, but B, to meet people that might have an opportunity to have something happen in the future.

[00:35:53] You don’t know what’s going to happen with those relationships. You know, somebody you met at the Grand Hyatt bar four or five years ago, you know, might be somebody that you’re doing a lot of business with. Today, it’s the same thing with these podcast episodes, right? I’m interviewing people every single week, sometimes multiple times a week.

[00:36:09] I’m pushing out the podcast every single week, and I am hopeful and open to all kinds of opportunities that might happen as a result of those interviews, but I don’t know what’s going to happen. So, about, 16, 18 months ago, I was on a Slack community. It was all about partnerships. And I just put a post in there and said, Hey, I’m I’m starting a new podcast.

[00:36:33] It’s all about partnerships. Let me know if you’d like to be a guest on the, on the partnership, unpacked podcast. And this young lady reached out and said, Hey, I’d like to have my CEO be a guest on your podcast. We run a marketing agency down in South Florida and we think she’d be a great guest on the podcast.

[00:36:50] I said, sure, absolutely. Bring her on. So she was my guest on the podcast. My first. And I say it that way because the first four episodes I’d actually recorded three years ago, and then had to stop for some other stuff. So I brought those back and then started all afresh. First week of January, 2023.

[00:37:10] Robin Diamond was my first guest on the new Reborn Partnership Unpacked podcast. We had a fantastic conversation. I’d never met her before she came onto The Green Room. Never seen her before in my life, other than her LinkedIn profile and the information she submitted via the form. So that was very much a cold call for us.

[00:37:28] But we talked a little bit in the green room, then we did the interview, and then we talked a lot more after the call, and started to develop a relationship, started to develop a rapport. Fast forward now a year and a half later. She’s my co host on the Marketech show. She’s been a speaker multiple times for me in the summit.

[00:37:42] I actually got to meet her for the first time face to face a couple of weeks ago in Miami at the e commerce evolution experience event. I hate that word. It’s too many

[00:37:51] Jeff Sieh: very long.

[00:37:53] Mike Allton: It’s very hard to say, but the EEE event in Miami, we got to meet for the first time, so, I mean, she’s one of my best friends now.

[00:37:59] We’re doing so many fantastic things together all as a result of her being a guest. On that podcast, her team is promoting the Martech show like gangbusters every single week. So she’s helping us. We’re helping them. It’s a great relationship. Just a simple example of one of the kinds of things that can happen as a result of bringing somebody on your podcast and having this opportunity to have a, just a frank and informal conversation.

[00:38:23] I

[00:38:25] Jeff Sieh: want to mention real quick Connor that like And it can be a slow burn, right? You mentioned 10 years ago, like, we, I don’t know how long ago it was when we first had Guy on our show, but now, all those years later, I’m doing his podcast. And it’s because the relationship we, we did all those times ago, and, and Touch and Bass in between there, and Peg Fitzpatrick, who, you know, really helped formulate that, going forward.

[00:38:46] But those all

[00:38:47] Mike Allton: think it was also because you stalked him outside of his

[00:38:50] Jeff Sieh: No, that was, gosh, that was at South by Southwest and that was before even Mobile Live was a thing. We had this contraption with Ronnie Bincer that we like duct taped together and it’s like so wild. Yeah, that was, that was when I just started growing my beard. Anyway, but yeah, but those things happen because you don’t know and like that’s why you have to be consistent and keep doing it and keep reaching out.

[00:39:13] and the other thing is, Other podcasters, like Mike has been on my show. He’ll say like, Hey, you need to have this person on your show. And I’ll say, yeah, hey, you also, I have the connection here. You should try to get this person ’cause it would make perfect sense. And those kind of things, which aren’t really a part of the podcast are kind of the outside of it, but make a huge difference on guests that you get and are able to, you know, you know, have, build relationships with

[00:39:40] Mike Allton: That’s a great point. And that’s something you need to build into that routine, right? Once you’ve interviewed one person from your target ICP, whoever that is, right? Ask them. Do you know anybody else who’d love to come on the show? Anyone else that I should be talking to? And they may or may not know anybody.

[00:39:55] They might not think of anybody right then. Put that into the email that you send them afterwards also as a reminder. Hey, just don’t forget if there’s anybody else you can think of that can be on the show, that’d be great. Because again, they’re probably going to come up with somebody just like them that you didn’t know, but that’s still part of your target audience.

[00:40:09] And now you’ve got a warm introduction instead of a cold outreach. And it’s so much more likely that you’ll get that next person on the show.

[00:40:15] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, very, very cool.

[00:40:16] Conor Brown: I love that. I mean, I think you can totally see the power of creating connections and building relationships just through this alone. And Mike, you’re doing it so much at Agora Pulse and, and I love that. And Jeff, I’m going to kind of combine a couple of questions here, but you know, talk a little bit more about how have you leveraged podcasts to strengthen relationships, but more so I’m interested in hearing a podcast is done and it’s a piece of content.

[00:40:41] How have you taken that and, and. Gone through effective ways to create new connections and strengthen existing ones. I know you talk about a lot about making sure the sales team has what they need from content that you’ve created, but how have you seen that work? Taking content from this kind of podcast strategy and creating relationships or building on existing ones?

[00:41:03] Mike Allton: Yeah. A lot of it has to do with that social proof that I mentioned. Earlier, right? Where once you’ve done a few of these and you’ve gotten some folks and you’ve actually published the podcast and you’ve, you’ve made them look good. Now, the next time you reach out to somebody new, it’s a little bit easier.

[00:41:19] You can share some specific names. They don’t decide to be names that they know. If they aren’t great, if not, that’s okay too. But at least they’re real people that you’ve had on the show. Right. And you can link to the show and you can show them. Here’s the content I’m creating. You know, Jeff, you mentioned earlier, you know, sometimes as guests, we sometimes get clips or even appear on shows where we’re like, Oh, Oh, gosh, that was

[00:41:40] Jeff Sieh: That’s right, right,

[00:41:42] Mike Allton: You know, the, the person was talking all over me. the, the, the quality of the show wasn’t very good. you know, they, they went in strange directions with the questions and these are all things that as a podcast host, we want to make sure, we want to make sure that we’ve got these buttoned down, that we’re listening.

[00:41:59] Doing active listening and not just, you know, trying to think about what we can say next. Right. But what is this person actually saying? How can we drill down into that? How we, how can we make them look good? Both technically. Right and audibly we want to make them look fantastic So you have to invest a lot of time in that that way when you do go to show The next person the next person in the next person that you want to be on the show that you want to develop that relationship With you’ve got that content.

[00:42:26] The other nice thing too as a Ancillary benefit again, this goes back to the zero listen strategy is that when you’re sharing To your social channels or the other person’s sharing to their social channels, this kind of content, whether it’s the original podcast or some of the repurposed content, if it looks great, other people will be impressed by that.

[00:42:46] I’m, I look forward to sharing the video snippets to my Instagram reels, to my TikTok, to my Facebook reels, to my YouTube source. These are channels I never used to use, but now I’ve got great short video clips that I can share that. Most of the clips is the other people, right? We talked about that. We established that we’re trying to make them look good, but correlation, I look pretty good, right?

[00:43:11] I brought these people on the show, right? It’s, it’s my show. And, and half the time, it’s just a clip of me going. Nodding, nodding, nodding. I almost want to slap my video team because that’s like every clip that they create. It’s just me nodding, but that’s fine. You know, I can look okay. Nodding, but you know, but if it’s, if it’s Robin Diamond, if it’s Greg Russ from Oracle, if it’s, Lee Oden from TopRank Marketing, you know, saying something smart.

[00:43:36] In a clip, that’s fantastic. I had, one of my favorite interviews was Laura Gassler Otting who wrote the book, Wonder Hell, fantastic book, amazing guest. In fact, that’s how I got Mitch Joel cause they’re best friends. When I shared Laura’s clip to social media, well, I actually shared the whole podcast, I talked about how we mentioned Mitch.

[00:43:59] In the show, because we talked about it. She tells a story about how Mitch got her an appearance on Good Morning America. That’s a pretty good story. Pretty good get for her. And that’s how good a friend Mitch is, right? He can get you on Good Morning America. So we talked about Mitch in the recording and I just happened to mention, by the way, we mentioned Mitch and I always mention anybody that’s mentioned in the show.

[00:44:19] I tag them so they know we’re talking about him in the show. So that’s how he listened to the show. He left a comment on the LinkedIn post. Hey, that was a pretty great interview. And I said, yeah, love to have you on the show next time, Mitch. And he said, yeah, Let’s do it. That’s the kind of thing that can happen if you’re creating great content.

[00:44:35] Jeff Sieh: And giving opportunities for that to respond by, because he might have not seen that if you didn’t at mention him. So, that’s a key part of strategy too, is you want to make sure, you want You mentioned some books, and I want to make sure that for you guys, if you guys go to JeffSieh. live, that’s my Amazon channel, Mike Alton’s books are right there, listed right below, we’re streaming live there as well, and if you want to check out his books, they’re amazing, he’s got, I think the one highlighted is the one about social media marketing that you co wrote with Jen Herman and some other people, Jen was on not very long ago, so JeffSieh.

[00:45:11] live, you can go check that out, but also, if Mike has a special for you guys who are watching, and I want to make sure to do this now and not, you know, smack dab at the end of the show. If you go to thesocialmediahat. com forward slash workbook, that’s thesocialmediahat. com forward slash workbook, he’s got a free thing for you.

[00:45:28] Talk, tell them a little bit about what this is, Mike.

[00:45:30] Mike Allton: Yeah. So this is actually a brand new product. You guys are hearing it here first. This is a complete marketing strategy workbook. So you need a marketing strategy for your business. You’ve never built one before. You don’t know where to begin. This is it. It’s going to take you through setting up your goals, figuring out what your overall strategy should be, how those business goals can align with marketing, business goals.

[00:45:49] I’m Jeff Sieh, and I’m going to be talking to you today about how you can create an email plan, an SEO plan, a content plan, and it’s even going to help you make sure that your team is aligned with all this and give you a structure to have your whole team have, you know, a, Goals, initiatives, we call them big rocks and a meeting structures that you can meet with them one on one or as a team every single week.

[00:46:15] And how are you going to outline all that? So that at the end of every quarter, you can look back and say, these were all the goals that we set up at the end of the quarter and we worked all quarter, and this is what we accomplished. It’s going to keep you and your entire business on track with your marketing.

[00:46:28] It’s 25 bucks, but if you use the coupon freebeard. com, You get it for free today.

[00:46:33] Jeff Sieh: Freebeard, that is great. So, yeah, so his, Mike’s stuff is always top notch, so you need to get this while you have a chance, because his stuff is always amazing, and I’ve learned a lot from him. Over the years, but I want to kind of, we’ll, we’ll put this link up towards the end as well, but I want to make sure when we’re talking about this, you know, zero listen podcast and kind of a flipping podcasting on its head because we, so many indie podcasters are about downloads.

[00:46:59] If somebody is wanting, as a business owner, To start to use a podcast to focus on partnerships, what we’ve been talking about, what’s the, the biggest advice that you would give that business owner when they’re getting ready to start out? Like what, you know, what are some mistakes maybe you’ve made after you’ve done now five podcasts that you wish you would have done at the start?

[00:47:19] Because I know a lot of, you know, you’ve learned a lot from doing this. what would you tell that new, that business who’s wanting to do podcasting in this way for the first time?

[00:47:28] Mike Allton: Well, the first inherent truth here is that a zero listen podcast by definition is we’re not really paying attention to the listens. And that’s something I don’t want to gloss over because as a first time podcaster, you don’t know necessarily how many listens are a good number of listens. But that’s the metric you figured that you should be paying attention to.

[00:47:49] So when you see that a podcast got 25 listens, 30 listens, 50 listens, you’re like, that’s not very many. I suck.

[00:47:57] Jeff Sieh: unless they’re in a room with Brian.

[00:48:00] Mike Allton: Yeah, exactly. Now, and that’s a great example that a lot of people have used, right? Cause like you say, imagine if you were in a room and 50 people were in the room, listening to you give that presentation, you’d be pretty proud of yourself.

[00:48:11] Right. And that’s a hundred percent true. And that’s one of the challenges with podcasts is the consumption rate is so much smaller than other pieces of content. We, we get to see. Eventually statistics from Libsyn and other places that say, well, yeah, if you’ve got over a hundred listeners for your podcast, you’re like in the top 20 percent of podcasts being consumed.

[00:48:30] I didn’t know that the first time I made a podcast, the first time I made a podcast was called Marketing Hyperdrive. And I went like through 11, 12, 15. episodes of that every single week and by the end I was getting 100 150 listens per episode and I thought that sucked. I thought that was awful. I was used to the heyday of, of, blog posts when I might get, you know, 500, 1, 000, 1, 500 visits to a blog post.

[00:48:57] I’m even used to social media, right, where a single tweet or a LinkedIn post would get at least 100 to 200 more likes. Views, a hundred listens of a podcast. That seems like a total waste of time to me. So I quit and I didn’t do podcasts for probably a year or more. Then I launched a new podcast on virtual events and, and these were all personal podcasts for me.

[00:49:19] so there are other reasons for not doing it. Not the least of which is I hate editing my own.

[00:49:23] Jeff Sieh: That’s right, yeah,

[00:49:24] Mike Allton: that, which is why I’m paying you, Jeff, to edit all my podcasts going forward. So that’s the first piece of advice is now we don’t have to pay attention to listens and we don’t to get depressed if they’re not very big, because that’s not the goal.

[00:49:36] The second thing is to think about very specifically, again, the target audience that you want to work with. Now, if it’s for partnerships, specifically brands. Or influencers that you might potentially want to build a relationship with and partner with. This is where it’s an opportunity for you to create that relationship and look at it as a win win.

[00:49:57] And I phrase it that way because having Like in my case, a social media manager come on the show. That’s not necessarily a win win. It’s, it’s really not like that at all, right? I’m not giving them business or anything like that. But if I bring a high level, great example, right? We had a high level on the Martech show this week.

[00:50:18] That’s a partnership. The Martech show is a little different from these other zero list podcasts where the Martech show is designed to be a co marketing, lead generation. Webinar up front. It’s a weekly webinar on Wednesdays. You register for free and you show up, we use a different tool. We stream into a landing page and people attend, you know, 25, 50, 150 people.

[00:50:40] And they watch that episode where we’re talking with one of our strategic partners about the solutions that they solve. So that’s just really not about Agorapulse at all, even though we’re actually, we’re a big part of it, but it’s about the partner that we’re bringing on and the partner it’s. On them to also promote the show they’re required.

[00:51:01] So when you bring a guest on, I mean, you’re like, I’m here. You didn’t require that. I promote this show, right? if I do great, if I add it to some of my other channels and we’re streaming a lot of my other channels, fantastic. But that wasn’t part of the deal. If you’re looking at it from a partnership perspective, that’s part of the deal.

[00:51:19] That should be actually spelled out. Whether you use a full, blown term sheet or, it’s just a understood agreement, either is fine, but they need to be part of that process.

[00:51:31] Jeff Sieh: That’s a great point.

[00:51:33] Conor Brown: I love that. So, when it comes to that, Mike, when it comes to creating the podcast itself, how do you ensure that when you’re talking about your goals, about what you want this episode to accomplish, that you’re still balancing good podcast creation, good content creation, while also creating engaging and valuable content?

[00:51:58] Episode that, you know, your partner, your listener, your specific audience is going to be engaging with. Because like you’re saying, you know, if it’s a weekly show, you got to do something every single week. We got this, this schedule. So how do you balance that? How do you balance the consistent content creation while ensuring that it remains engaging and it remains, you know, listenable, I guess you could say, to the audience that you want to hear.

[00:52:25] Mike Allton: So every single guest that I bring on, I had them fill out a guest onboarding form because I want to make sure obviously I have their preferred headshot, their bio, their links, all that sort of thing. But I also ask a couple of key questions in that onboarding form. What’s something that you want to teach?

[00:52:40] Our target audience in 30 minutes or less, or what’s a particular challenge that you faced in your business and how did you solve that? I ask, are there any of the key takeaways or lessons that you want to share with this audience? And there’s different variations and versions of those questions, depending on, on the show and the target audience.

[00:52:59] But the key is I’m asking them up front, what is it that we could potentially talk about? Then I build a document, you know, and Jeff, you know, you and I did this, you know, for this show, we had a brief conversation, you know, over messenger, you know, what are we going to talk about? What are the potential topics?

[00:53:16] We kind of talked that through a little bit, and then you came up with some questions that we could potentially talk through. I did the same thing with my shows and that’s all scripted out. My intro is scripted. The questions are scripted. The segues are scripted. And I’m, I’m honestly reading from that script most of the time.

[00:53:30] So. Now I can, you know, go on tangents and I can improvise, which is fine, but I don’t have to, because a lot of that’s already scripted out. And I also share those questions in advance with the guests, just like you and I did, Jeff, so that A, there’s no surprises. And B, in the B2B space, this is critical because a lot of the people that you may be talking to on your show may have to get approval.

[00:53:52] Jeff Sieh: Oh, that’s a good

[00:53:53] Mike Allton: When I bring in brands like TikTok, like Meta, like Oracle, like, you know, They’ve got legal departments and legal wants to know or their PR department or the communications department wants to know, who are you talking to? How long are you talking to? What are you going to say? And all that has to be, if not exactly decided, at least agreed upon in advance, because they want to make sure that I’m not going to put the guest in a position that they’re going to be asked to, You know, make, make the platform not look good, right?

[00:54:21] Just yesterday afternoon, I was interviewing, you know, someone from TikTok, right? And we couldn’t have talked about the, the struggles that TikTok is having right now with the United States Congress and them wanting to ban, you know, ByteDance from the United States. That’s not something that would have been acceptable in that conversation.

[00:54:40] We didn’t know in advance. We’re going to talk about the platform. We’re going to talk about TikTok shop and all those kinds of things. So That’s really how I do it is I make sure that they’re telling me in advance what they want to talk about. And I’m taking the time to build out a full flow and talking points and questions for the show.

[00:54:58] And for some of the guests that might mean I have to spend a lot of time up front and doing some research. Maybe they don’t give me a lot of information in the, In the questionnaire, or maybe it’s a topic I don’t know a lot about, or maybe it’s a guest I don’t know a lot about. For Laura Gasser Otting, I read the book.

[00:55:15] I read Wonder Hill, right? I took that time. Fortunately, it was, it was scheduled for enough advance. I had time to do that, but that means, you know, the whole show could be about the book and specific parts and segments of the book and the lessons that she was, bring up and for those who aren’t familiar, it’s a fantastic book.

[00:55:32] It’s this idea that we work so hard. To achieve success, whatever that looks like to us. And then after we achieve it, there’s almost inevitably this huge roller coaster, all that kind of like, Oh, well I did that. Now what, what’s, what’s next? I got to achieve something else. And we’re on this roller coaster now of always having to go on to the next thing and the next thing and the next thing.

[00:55:54] Fantastic exploration of this phenomenon, particularly in business. So it’s all about guest preparation. Now, some folks don’t want to document all that and that’s fine. But if you want to achieve the kind of results that we’re talking about achieving with this strategy of podcasting, then you at least have to go into these interviews with a good sense in your mind of, this is what I’m talking about.

[00:56:15] This is who I’m talking about. This is where they’ve struggled. And I want to dig into that. It is totally possible to not do that. Have this documented, because you can have a formula that you go into over and over again. What was it that you were struggling with? Oh, okay. Why was that such a struggle for you?

[00:56:33] How’d that make you feel?

[00:56:34] in.

[00:56:35] How long were you struggling with that?

[00:56:37] have

[00:56:38] What was it that made you decide you needed to solve? That problem, how long did it take you to solve it? What did you actually do? What’d that cost you? And then your question earlier, which is perfect is how did you get management buy in to actually pursue that solution?

[00:56:54] Right? That was what? Eight, nine questions. That’s a whole podcast right there. And you could probably ask those exact same questions for every single guest. If that’s the kind of interview format that you want for your show, right? Where you’re just talking through the problems that they’ve gone through.

[00:57:09] Jeff Sieh: So that’s what I was going to ask you is that, the, the question, I guess like John Lee Dumas asked the same questions of every guest every time. Personally, I want a little bit more mix up with that, but you could do that. And, but it’s, there’s a big debate and I’ve had it and I, I, we’ve had people on our show, like they, they, they never give their guests questions.

[00:57:26] Because they want it to be on the fly and raw and stuff. And like, I get that for an indie podcast kind of thing. I have always done it one, because like you said, I don’t want to surprise the guests. I want to have a show flow in my mind. Now, Connor knows we go way off track lots of times. If the conversation is, or something interesting that I think of, or Connor thinks of that we do, but it also, because we’ve had people like before the show and the pre show will go.

[00:57:49] You know, questions were great, but I don’t really want to talk about this because I don’t know enough or it’s changed. And so that’s great because the last thing you want to do, especially with the zero listen podcast strategy is make your guests look foolish or not, or make them feel uncomfortable because they didn’t know the answer to a question.

[00:58:07] So I think that is. Spot on. man, once again, free consulting for me. it’s gone over, but Mike, thank you so much for your time. Once again, I want to, you know, make sure you guys go check out all Mike’s books over at jeffsieh. live. It’s my Amazon channel. It’s right there at the top, but he’s also given.

[00:58:26] access to his, his a workbook on social media, which his stuff is so good. He’s such a good writer. There Never, there never will be an AI Mike Alden, there just never will be. but if you go to the social media hat.com/workbook, that’s thus social media hat.com/workbook. And what was the code Free beard?

[00:58:45] Is that what it was?

[00:58:46] Mike Allton: Free beard.

[00:58:47] Jeff Sieh: Okay. To get it, for a limited time, make sure you guys go check that out. Mike, what else is going on with you other than all these podcasts that you’re doing, and writing all the time? This guy doesn’t sleep. We used to joke, back in the day that he would use one hand to write two articles at the same time.

[00:59:02] You know, he’s just all over. He would write some the blogging brute is what I used to call him. So,

[00:59:06] Mike Allton: I’m actually blogging while we’re talking

[00:59:08] Jeff Sieh: That’s probably true, yeah, he probably is. He probably is. What else you got going on?

[00:59:13] Mike Allton: Well, we’ve got a big quarterly summit, coming up. That’s next week, March 14th, the Social Pulse Summit Retail Edition. So again, we’re talking to retailers and social media managers for retail brands. That’s a big part of our ICP this quarter for Agorapulse. so that summit’s all about them, but I would encourage you, if you’re a social media manager, to Check out that agenda because you’re probably going to find some things in there that apply to you regardless of retail.

[00:59:36] But we’re kicking off with the keynote from Carol Speakerman, who is a giant in the retail industry. We’ve got specific sessions from some of the top marketers for specific platforms. Like you mentioned, Jen Herman. She’s doing a session for me on Instagram. Wave Wild is there about TikTok. Then we’ve got big brands.

[00:59:52] TikTok is there, in a couple places. I’m leading some conversations and some panels. So that’s all happening next week and go to gorepulse. com to find that and yeah, we’re launching Social Pulse Podcast Retail Edition, Social Pulse Podcast Agency Edition, and Social Pulse Podcast Hospitality Edition in the next few months.

[01:00:12] So if you can resonate with any of those sectors, you can watch out for those shows coming soon.

[01:00:17] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, I’m looking forward to listening to those, because I always learn stuff. Even, it’s always good to go even outside and, and kind of push yourself. Maybe something like, well, I’m not in retail, but you can take some strategies from there and apply them to your own business. So, it’s always great to kind of expand your horizons a little bit, listening to some different types of podcasts.

[01:00:35] Connor Brown. The unsinkable Connor Brown. What’s going on with you? What is happening in your world? What you got going on.

[01:00:42] Conor Brown: all my stuff, Jeff, you already gave me a fantastic plug, but you can go over to WDWopinion. com or follow me across social medias at WDW Opinion, talking theme parks, vacations, all that fun stuff.

[01:00:54] Jeff Sieh: And with that, we thank you. Thanks Mike for doing this again. I always enjoy having you on the show. Make sure you guys go check out his podcast, all this stuff. He’s going on his blog at the social media hat, get that workbook. And with that, we’ll see you guys next week. Thank you so much for watching everybody.

[01:01:07] We’ll see you next time. Bye everybody.

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