Opportunities for creators have expanded, but so has the level of competition. This week on Social Media News Live, we’re talking with Katie Fawkes, Director of Marketing at Ecamm, about the challenges of keeping the Creator Economy sustainable from both a brand and creator perspective! 

We’ll also cover monetization opportunities, how to stand out as a new or niche creator, and get her take on being BOTH a marketer and a creator as she hosts The Flow podcast. Check out The Flow podcast at https://flow.ecamm.com


This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

[00:00:00] Jeff Sieh: Hey folks, welcome to New another edition of Social Media News Live. We are so glad that you’re here. Um, after you’re joining us, we would love for you to ask as many questions as you want. We have the amazing Katie Fox with us today. We’re gonna be talking about all sorts of cool stuff about the creator economy.

[00:00:17] And if you know somebody who is a creator and you know, maybe is just starting out or wants to take their creativity to the next level. Make sure you a, uh, mention them down below and call them in. Even if they can’t watch it live. We will answer their questions later, but we would love to have them be a part of the show.

[00:00:32] But, uh, Grace, Duffy, how are you doing?

[00:00:35] Katie Fawkes: I am

[00:00:36] Jeff Sieh: good. You consternated there for a minute. You’re like,

[00:00:39] Grace Duffy: well, I was trying to like find, uh, anyway. No, I’m good. I’m good. I’m not Consternated. I am happy to

[00:00:45] Katie Fawkes: be here with all

[00:00:46] Jeff Sieh: of you. Consternated. So anybody Consternated? Am I cons? Yes. Not the other

[00:00:50] Grace Duffy: word. So welcome to the pre-show Bickering

[00:00:53] Jeff Sieh: Yes, right. We are also live on Amazon, so, uh, very, very cool stuff. Um, by the way, if you’re watching, we had some people, I think it was, uh, Katie and, and messaged me earlier who were wanting to know about my, uh, earplugs. They’re actually on sale today on Amazon. You can go. They’re down there on the carousel.

[00:01:10] Um, they’re like 50% off. I know. They’re amazing. So where are they? Yeah, they’re the me audio. M six sports is what they are, but they’re like off. So

[00:01:20] Katie Fawkes: get them for like every, I, so I don’t know about you guys, but I’m the kind of person that’s always moving. So like, I’m, I’m, you know, working from home and I’m in one of the offices.

[00:01:28] I have them in like every single, the ones I have in every single space. Because inevitably I get there and I’m like, oh, I needed

[00:01:34] Jeff Sieh: headphones. I have spare ones, I have spare ones because I roll over them with my chair and I break them. What? Yeah, the little, the little knob. The other thing is if you’re on, if you’re watching on Amazon, get some of those.

[00:01:45] Uh, Amazon makes the cable extenders for Oh yeah. So getto, so you’re not like killing yourself. .

[00:01:52] Grace Duffy: I was gonna show you mine, but then I was gonna But then it would pull it

[00:01:55] Katie Fawkes: out. Yes. Oh, no, don’t do that. Don’t do that. I wanna be able to hear you and vice versa.

[00:02:00] Jeff Sieh: Before we get off Amazon, I wanted to give, because the beta for Ecamm M just rolled out, and Katie, I want you to talk about the cool stuff that’s come in for.

[00:02:08] Katie Fawkes: Oh my goodness. If you are an Ecamm user or if you’re not, this is the time to try . See it. This is the time to be an Ecamm user. But, uh, we just introduced, uh, a lot of new exciting Amazon features. So if you’re on Amazon Live, we’d love for you to test them out. Let us know what you think. Uh, basically you’re able to now see when you’re Streaming to Amazon using Ecamm.

[00:02:30] You can see who is watching, how many people are watching. You can see if they follow you, you get a notification and you’ll see all of the Amazon comments coming into Ecamm so you can feature them on screen and interact with them, uh, in ways that you weren’t able to do previously. So we’re really excited about it.

[00:02:46] We’re like all in this year for a focus on live selling, so, right. So yeah, let’s, let’s see what you guys can do with it. I’m excited. It’s so

[00:02:54] Jeff Sieh: exciting. I’ve been so looking forward to this, by the way. Uh, if you wanna find out more, make sure you go to socialmedianewslive.com/ecamm slash Ecamm. They are the sponsor of the show, but that’s not why we had Katie on today, but I’m getting ahead of myself.

[00:03:04] I wanna do a big shout out to our friend Gary Stockton, walking, watching over on YouTube. He’s saying Good morning and happy MLK weekend everyone. Thank you Gary. Hello. Appreciate seeing you here. Uh, and our friend Brian Ferrell is also watching from uh, YouTube. He says, good evening, lovely people. Of course, he’s in Barcelona, so it’s evening for him.

[00:03:21] So thanks Brian. Brian is a creator cuz we’re talking about the creator economy today. He is an amazing photographer and so I’m excited that he’s watching as well. And then Nikki says, loving the show. Thanks team. Thank you Nikki, for watching. We appreciate that. So, and we’ve got Dustin Stout going. I’m back.

[00:03:38] It’s a little scary. It is Friday 13th and he’s doing the, the halter guys kind of thing there. So, uh, Justin’s good to see you my friend. Thanks for

[00:03:46] Grace Duffy: Oh, and he has a beard now.

[00:03:47] Jeff Sieh: Hello? I like, oh, he’s got long hair. He looks a little jesusy, but that’s okay. I like, I like that. So he looks a little jesusy. I love it.

[00:03:54] He’s rocking the Jesus like, all right, so we’re gonna get started. I’m gonna hit go on the podcast machine and we’ll get started. So here we go.

[00:04:03] Hello folks. Welcome to Social Media News Live. I’m Jeff C and you’re

[00:04:06] Grace Duffy: Not . And I’m Grace Duffy. And this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the world of social media marketing and beyond.

[00:04:16] And today we have our friend Katie Foxtrot Ecamm. She’s on the show. And we’re gonna cover the Creator Economy in 2023. And what do we mean when we say creator economy? I know that that word is super buzzy these days, , and basically it is. An industry where in which talented people on the internet, like all of us, I hope, are leveraging social media audiences to develop careers as independent creatives, using their time, their talent, their skills, their passions, all of that to move brands forward.

[00:04:50] So in today we’re gonna talk about the challenges of keeping the creator economy sustainable from both the brand and a creator perspective. Fortunately, all of us have experience in each of those arenas. We’re also gonna cover monetization opportunities, how to stand out as a new or niche creator.

[00:05:06] Something that I know Katie likes to talk about, uh, when, uh, over at Ecamm. And then also getting Katie’s take on being both a marketer and a creator as she hosted. She just completed her first year of hosting the Flow podcast, so gonna hear about all that and more so very.

[00:05:23] Jeff Sieh: Yes. And uh, Katie, I’m so glad that you’re here and I want to, if you don’t know Katie, oh my gosh, I can’t, I’m so excited to introduce her to you because, uh, she is the market, the director of marketing at Ecamm M Network.

[00:05:34] She gets to work alongside some of the most amazing live streamers and content creators, helping them reach their goals and grow their business using video marketing and live Streaming. Like, uh, Grace said she’s also fresh off a year, a year. That’s

[00:05:48] Katie Fawkes: a big, not, not quite. I’m, I’m halfway cuz we started halfway through the last year.

[00:05:51] I’ll take it. I’m, I’m we’ll round

[00:05:53] Jeff Sieh: up. We’ll round up. So a podcast, we’ll, we’ll round up. We’re very generous here, but she’s been doing sessions in this kind of stuff. Uh, she’s been hosting her own live, uh, podcast and it’s called The Flow. So wanna pull that up on the screen so you guys make sure that you guys go there.

[00:06:06] Give her a rating and review because it is a weekly show that will take you step by step through the process of video podcasting. Mm-hmm. . And it’s focused on building efficient and effective workflow so that your content really shines. So go check it out at flow dot Ecamm dot com. It is amazing. And just a little, uh, we’ll get into it later.

[00:06:25] I’ve got some little breaking news, so you’ll have to stick around, but I’m so excited she’s here. Katie, welcome to the.

[00:06:31] Katie Fawkes: I’m so excited to be here. This is like the best way to spend Friday. So , that’s what we

[00:06:36] Jeff Sieh: think too. I’m glad that you feel that way. Yeah. So yeah, and, and I mentioned it before, but our sponsor is Ecamm, so make sure you go check them out at socialmedianewslive.com/ecamm slash Ecamm.

[00:06:45] They are what makes this show happen. There is a ton of cool stuff coming out, uh, on Ecamm. We’ll get into that a little bit later, but you just wanna go check it out. So go to socialmedianewslive.com/ecamm. Ecamm Grace. You told me to speed it up today and I’m trying my hardest, um, but I’m so excited. You know, it probably won’t go, it’s not gonna happen.

[00:07:03] But, uh, let’s dive right into this first thing of that we have the getting the sustaining the creator economy because this is really boring,

[00:07:11] Grace Duffy: keeping it’s sustainable. So facts, we’re gonna lay down some facts. Opportunities for creators have expanded. There have been never before. Have. So many opportunities.

[00:07:22] And also with that, the level of competition has ramped up. Video used to be, back in the day when we first started doing this together, Jeff used to be a way to stand out. It’d be different. And now everyone is using video on their marketing. Also, the expectations have shifted. We used to have more polished scripted videos, which there’s still a place for that of course, but the reality is that we’re very focused on being real and imperfect.

[00:07:45] In fact, as we starting the show, I did my be reel this morning. That’s correct. You did. So . So, you know, to the point, there’s a proliferation of rising social media platforms and um, we’re just gonna say some chaos at some others. You know, little, little scramble. We talked about this a little bit last week as well.

[00:08:01] Uh, and there’s also been challenges with monetizing content. It’s challenging and it seems rare to make a solid living off of their work. Or at least, you know, as Katie put it earlier in the or beginning of the show is like people aren’t necessarily monetizing in the way that. Most people think that they are.

[00:08:18] And also you, let’s be honest, there’s a lot of turnover and burnout. Mm-hmm. when it comes to creating content. There’s a slight feeling of this oversaturation that more and more platforms are becoming the same, as more people turn to content as a source of income. And it might be a little bit harder for people that are new, new, new into this game, or people that have different perspectives to really surface.

[00:08:40] And the problem with that is that you’ll just have a lack of diversity or inclusion. But you know, we want to make this, you know, Ecamm is one of those tools that makes this accessible to everyone. But tell me, Katie, is this true? Have you seen or heard this from your own customers over at Ecamm that it is getting a little bit harder than how are they overcoming it?

[00:08:57] Katie Fawkes: Yeah, I, it’s a, it’s a crazy space out there and I think everything that you said is, is incredibly true. As more and more people are trying to figure out, like, okay, keep getting told over and over and over again. I keep seeing that I need to be doing video, I need to be doing more video. It’s really hard to try to figure out like where your space is.

[00:09:15] Um, but I will say, uh, kind of on the sunny side of that, there is definitely still a space for everyone and I think it really comes down to having a really solid strategy, knowing what you wanna get out of it, and knowing. What your space is, what your niche is, what your, uh, target audience is, you know, who are those people that you’re trying to reach?

[00:09:34] Uh, it’s not possible to do absolutely everything, and especially in a space where there are new platforms and new features on these platforms happening on a regular minute by minute basis. Mm-hmm. . So we all need to remind ourselves that, you know, we need to take it slow and be consistent and really understand what we as creators are trying to get out of that process and that experience.

[00:09:55] Because there’s gonna be a lot of noise that’s gonna cause a lot of distractions and anxiety and burnout.

[00:10:01] Jeff Sieh: So, uh, I wanted to, to bring up, because, uh, there’s so many creators right now. In our audience who’s watching, we had Dustin here a little earlier. Uh, my friend Connor Brown. Brown is killing it on TikTok.

[00:10:10] He was actually on our show. He goes, Hey, part people excited to hear more about the state of the creator economy. He’s doing really, really good using, uh, TikTok to Awesome sell his guide services that he does at Disney. So, uh, Connor, thank you for watching. Another incredible creator is our friend, uh, Chris Stone.

[00:10:27] He is saying awesome guest, the best show on the interwebs. Chris is a big, uh, supporter of the show. I appreciate you, my friend, but he is killing it with deal casters over on, uh, Amazon and Amazon Live. And so, uh, really appreciate him stopping by. But then of course we’ve got, and I was just on their show.

[00:10:42] We’ve got Fujin and Anna, uh, popping in over on, uh, YouTube. Um, they are killing it with, with the stuff they’re doing. So yeah, they’re they’re coming on next week. Yeah, that’s right on their show. This is just amazing. We have all these amazing creators, but. , seeing all these people are watching the show, they’re all creators.

[00:11:03] A lot of them are in these kind of specific niches or niches. Mm-hmm. , however you wanna say it. Yep. Um, . But what do you think is the thing that kind of, that they all kind of fit under? Like, what’s your advice for standing out with live video? Because all those people do live video. Um, how, how are they all doing it and being successful?

[00:11:24] Is there one thing you can put your finger on, um, Katie, that you can think of? Why people are, I guess why, how are people, what’s the best way people can be successful with live video? .

[00:11:36] Katie Fawkes: Yeah. I, I think honestly, it comes down to mindset. And I, I know that that’s probably not what everyone necessarily wants to hear, but successful is gonna mean really different things for different people.

[00:11:46] And I would say that again, if you can go back and figure out what your goals are for getting started past just someone told you that you should be on video , right? Whatever that means. Um, you know, it, the reality is, is that not every single one of these shows and podcasts and live streams are gonna have millions and millions and millions of subscribers and followers and fans.

[00:12:08] And we’re not all going to become, you know, instant celebrities overnight. Right. But that doesn’t mean that, that there are not, you know, millions of shows out there that are hugely successful that, you know, have these really. , like, um, intense, you know, pat Fling calls them like a super fan bases, right?

[00:12:25] Where you could have 20, 30, 50, a hundred, 200, you know, really dedicated listeners who, you know, rave about you and are able to support what your goals are, whether that’s our financial or otherwise. So I would say that there is. Definitely a space for everyone that we need to kind of rethink our mindset on what success means and on how long it takes to get there.

[00:12:49] We’re we’re told over and over again that, you know, it’s, it’s, we have this kind of million dollar number in our spread, right? Right. Million subscribers, a million dollars, a million, everything. And that’s not what it’s gonna, it’s not what it takes to be successful for the mass majority of us. So start rethinking that.

[00:13:04] Mm-hmm. and really kind of find what your space is and what those goals are, and when you hit them, then you know, then set the next goals, set the next thing. But it’s gonna be a slow process and a level of consistency to get

[00:13:16] Jeff Sieh: there. Yeah. So one of the things Absolutely, there’s that, I don’t, can’t remember who said it, but don’t, it was like, don’t compare your start to somebody else’s.

[00:13:23] Um,

[00:13:23] Katie Fawkes: think Oh, absolutely. Or you know, like you’re not, you know, like I use Dak Shepard all the time as an example cause I’m a diehard fan of armchair expert. Yeah. But like, we all need to remember that. Like, Dak, she was already famous when he started his podcast, right? A little Right. Had a super famous wife and started his podcast with an interview with his super famous wife and has like a, so like, and had tons of money.

[00:13:48] And even him, like, I, I think a lot of those numbers aren’t real and are kind of set up to make us feel, you know, inadequate and, and feel this kind of push to, to do more and to be on more platforms and to be on more places. And I think we all need to remember that, you know, there are creators out there that are making a ton of money and that are, you know, building these really effective businesses who have, again, You know, a fraction of what mm-hmm.

[00:14:14] what many of us would consider success.

[00:14:15] Jeff Sieh: So, yeah. So on that note, um, one of the things like for us, this is our third year. This is our third year of doing this show, which we think it’s successful, but one of the things is, is you have to define success for yourself. And you mentioned that Katie, like success for us may look different for success for somebody else.

[00:14:33] Some people may just want to do, we do this for community because we love this community. I love getting the comments. I do love doing this live show. Yeah. Because it’s community, uh, and in fact, Robert Lee says, yep, a thousand percent a big believer in preaching, identifying what your goals and purposes for starting a channel or launching into a live Restream.

[00:14:51] Yeah. That is really, really key. And then Chris says, uh, that’s it. There’s power in the niches, especially in podcasting. A hundred percent. Which very true. And so, . Yeah. And Paul goes, if you compare your, your start to someone else middle, you created your finish. Ooh, that’s a tweetable Paul way to go.

[00:15:08] Katie Fawkes: There you go.

[00:15:09] Jeff Sieh: All for the win. That’s right. So are there some steps that you, like when you talk to these new creators? Cause you have a lot of people coming in on Ecamm because they wanna create content and it’s not just for live. You can create, you know, presentations, you know, TikTok videos, all sorts of things with Ecamm.

[00:15:25] Do you, when you’re kind of consulting or talking with people, do you like give them like any sort of roadmap or anything like that for defining success or you know, for them to figure out what success is for them? .

[00:15:37] Katie Fawkes: Yeah. I mean, we do, we do a lot of, um, you know, live trainings and tutorials and, and demos and blog posts.

[00:15:44] A lot of content around thinking through, you know, what the planning, the planning stage and the workflow stage. Right? So like, what, what do you want to accomplish and how can you get there in a way that’s really efficient and isn’t going to make you feel really bogged down? Right? Like, you’re gonna, you’re gonna need to, you stand up and then take the first step before you’re walking, before you’re running, before, you know, before you get all the way there.

[00:16:07] And, and, you know, tools like Ecamm M are awesome, but can also kind of cause a little bit of that level of anxiety because you can do so much, right, right. As you just said. Mm-hmm. , like, you can, you can record videos, you can live Restream, you can, you know, you can improve your meetings in Zoom, you can do all of these different things, but you shouldn.

[00:16:25] Do all of those at once, and you shouldn’t do all of those when you’re just getting started. So I think, you know, we have lots of conversations about like, why did you wanna do this in the first place? And most people have a level of passion or excitement, you know, they, there’s, there’s an element of, of fun in it that they want to do that that really is kind of the, the foundational part.

[00:16:46] So helping them figure out like, what about it is fun? What about it are you passionate about? Is there something that you wanna be helping people? get to or do or, you know, or bring some entertainment and some enjoyment to people. Let’s start there and figure out who that audience is, and then let’s figure out how you’re gonna do it.

[00:17:03] You know, where, where are those people? Where are the best platforms that they’re on? Mm-hmm. , are those the platforms that you as a creator want to spend time on and want to be creating on? Um, because all those platforms are different to, in what they offer and what, um, what their reach is and what their potential is.

[00:17:16] So, yeah. You know, I think we really try to, in everything we do, take it back to like, you know, these are really cool things you could do, but Right. You know, should you and does, does this make sense for you right now? Or is this something that you’re looking at later? Or is this something that is never gonna make sense for you?

[00:17:31] Like, there are, you know, there are things that Ecamm teaches that are never going to make sense for, you know, a huge part of our audience, but there’s an audience, you know, who wanna be doing like, you know, remote production work, right. Or like, really, you know, huge productions. , you know, that’s not gonna make sense for our YouTube creators, but that’s okay.

[00:17:50] They might get ideas for themselves from it, but they, we don’t expect them or want them to be doing everything that doesn’t make sense for their brand or, or for their themselves as creators.

[00:17:59] Jeff Sieh: Gotcha. The, the, makes sense. One of the things, and I wanna kind of take it a little bit back to what’s been in the news cycle lately.

[00:18:06] Mm-hmm. , because, uh, and I was actually on, on your Anna and Fujin show, and we talked a lot about this, but how do, and I have my opinions, but I wanna know you’re talking . How do you think live video is gonna be affected by services like chat, G P T and you know, the Jasper’s been up for a while. Yeah. And there’s more like popping up weekly.

[00:18:25] I just saw a guy. Then there’s this other service where you can actually upload your, your use, your video avatar, and then it’ll take, it’ll take it and create that using you, which is really freaky. It’s a little in Candy Valley there. But what is your thought about all this AI stuff? Because it’s, it’s in the news, Microsoft’s looks like they’re gonna, they put so many billions of dollars in it.

[00:18:45] What do you think this is gonna do to live video?

[00:18:48] Katie Fawkes: Yeah, so, um, you may, you all may or may not know this about me, but, um, but I come from a, uh, copywriting and a content marketing background and have done a, you know, a ton of work over my career in seo. And so I, I would say is, at least my feeling on it, is that it offers a huge potential for creators who are smart and who are willing to, to jump in and play around with it early on, on filling out all of that.

[00:19:14] all of that content, right? So we need to all remember that currently, and this may change obviously as things progress, but currently all of those search engines, Google, YouTube, which is the, you know, most powerful search engine out there for video. They don’t see images, they don’t see video, uh, they don’t hear audio very well or if at all.

[00:19:33] So we still need to be able to get all of that text content out there, right? So AI is a hugely effective way for us all to do that. We’re trying to save time. What we should be caring about is the content itself and being able to get that out there to people. So, you know, as you’re thinking through like what your topics are for your upcoming podcast or for your live show or for a training or tutorial that you’re doing, put those words into tools like chat, G b T or you know, any of these AI tools, and let them build out the SEO rich description for you.

[00:20:05] Let them, you know, think through what, what aspects of that topic you may not even thought about because they have access to. The entire internet, the hive mind. Right. . Right. So it, it’s not, uh, you know, I’m, it’s been interesting watching all these conversations happening on, you know, on LinkedIn and on all these platforms about like, you know, what do we do with this?

[00:20:24] What, what’s the potential, what are the fears and concerns about it? I would say that it, it’s going to, and I think Doc posted this, but it’s, it’s going to make those of us who dive in better, right? And we’re not, we’re not worried about, about AI stealing our jobs or about robots stealing our jobs or, or the creativity.

[00:20:42] We should be worried about people who are successful at it, stealing our jobs and our creativity. So I think it’s one of those things that we need to, um, we need to really double down on and think through ways that we can use it to help us surface our content better or make our content better by, by catching all of those important topics.

[00:20:59] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. Uh, in fact, I talked a lot about this on, uh, Ecamm M’s. Channel, so go watch that show I did with Anna Pigeon . Yes. But I, I’ll just, let’s, let’s comment here, Jeff. It’s funny. Yeah. I just will say one of the things is that, um, You know, and AI can’t build community right now. So it can,

[00:21:14] Katie Fawkes: it can. And uh, yeah.

[00:21:15] Hey Doc, I just stole your points so we can take it. We can, that’s right. Dock all of the credit for it. But yeah,

[00:21:21] Grace Duffy: I wanna read this for our absolutely. Podcast audience. So it says, doc Rock says, people out here having blockbuster thoughts , but I’ma do Netflix and bury them while they still stand. Yeah,

[00:21:30] Jeff Sieh: yeah.

[00:21:31] While they stand still. While they stand, they stand still. Stand still. That’s doc, doc. Have an opinion. Just very rare. So I’m glad we capture that on video it. Yeah. So, uh, we’re the podcast audience as well. Yes, right. Exactly. Exactly. So, alright, Grace, let’s, this is important, this next to topic, so I’ll go ahead and let you ask the question cuz I think this is a big struggle for all creators.

[00:21:52] Grace Duffy: Yeah. You know, Jeff and I talked about this quite a bit, so let’s address burnout and turnover in the creator space. Burnout is quite severe with 61% of creators facing burnout. According to Convert kits. This was their, uh, 2022 State of Creator economy report, so you can get access to that if you’re interested in finding more.

[00:22:10] A lot of them are citing that they feel pressured to post consistently and be everywhere. There’s comparison to other creators. You can go on and on and on with, with all the reasons why people are feeling this, this sense of burnout or turnover. And I think because we’re all on social media, there’s this feeling that we need to be online and on all the time, and we know that that’s, it’s just not sustainable.

[00:22:31] But what tips do you have from creators or your customers that you’ve talked to, that you’ve worked with on avoiding or overcoming or getting past this sense of like burnout when it comes to being a creator? Because it does take a lot of you, lot from you

[00:22:47] Katie Fawkes: to be creative. . Oh, yeah. Uh, I think it’s a hugely important topic and exists obviously beyond the creator, the creator space.

[00:22:56] Um, I, I think it comes down to a few different things. Um, one, I’m a big believer, as I said earlier about the cont, the concept of creating really effective, you know, time management workflows and really, you know, understanding what’s going to be possible within the time that you’ve allot. To your creator space, to your creativity, uh, and just create those boundaries.

[00:23:19] Don’t, you don’t need to be everywhere. You don’t need to be, you know, creating 5 million videos a week. You need to figure out what is sustainable for you to be effective. It’s much, much more important for you to be consistent than for you to be, you know, creating tons and tons and tons of content. Uh, and have, you know, I, like, I forget who said it, doc will probably correct me here in the comments

[00:23:44] Uh, but during our, during our, uh, Leap into podcasting, uh, virtual summit last year, we had one of our speakers say that, you know, you, we should all really be considering. Tools, all of the tools and software that we use as teammates. So, you know, often in this creator space, we are by ourselves. You know, maybe we have like a co-host or someone, one other person that’s helping us, but by and large, you know, we’re alone or we’re in these really small teams.

[00:24:08] And so find the tools that act like teammates, that make that process easier for you, that take some of the load off and get rid of all the other ones. You don’t need to have everything. It just can get really, um, daunting when you have kind of too much on your plate and too much going on. And then I, the second thing I would say is that, um, you know, really.

[00:24:31] E except the fact that it is okay and planned for taking breaks. You know, whether that means that you’re doing podcast seasons, uh, you know, or you’re taking off holidays, like, again, put up those boundaries. As long as you are letting your community and your listeners and your viewers know what your schedule is and what’s coming up, that’s okay.

[00:24:52] Like, that’s not, that’s not, you know, piecing out and dropping the ball. That is setting up boundaries and creating, uh, you know, sustainable schedules and, and being able to deliver to your viewers. They would rather you say that you’re taking off the, you know, Christmas holiday and you’ll be back on the other side better and stronger than ever than, you know, powering through and expecting like, well, if I don’t show up week after week, like, they’re gonna be gone.

[00:25:15] They’re only gonna be gone if you, if you don’t communicate effectively with them and let them know what the plan is. So, um, give yourself. Bit of permission and set yourself up for success cuz it, it does get hard and it is a lot of work. So, um, trying your best to avoid that as best as possible is, is always a good plan.

[00:25:31] Jeff Sieh: Right. I give my, my, my friend Ian Anderson great. A hard time cause he’s, he’s over in the UK and he, they’re always on holiday and I’m like, dude, I wish we would do that more in the us. I really do.

[00:25:42] Grace Duffy: I think burning ourselves out is just not as big of a flex as we think it is. Like saying it’s not,

[00:25:47] Katie Fawkes: it’s, yeah, it’s not, or whatever.

[00:25:50] It’s so true. Grace. I like, I, um, I’ve learned this a lot from, I’m, I am a total workaholic and I have grown up in the world of like, you know, the hardest one. The one who’s there, the one who shows up, the one who like will do anything is the one who wins. It is not the case anymore, and we need to start kind of de deprogramming ourselves from believing that.

[00:26:12] Mm-hmm. like, it, it, it’s okay to set those boundaries and I, it’s a challenge. I struggle with myself, but I, I’m here to tell you that if I can do it, you could. It’s okay to say I’m not on Slack today. Put up in a away message, . I’m not, you know, I’m not gonna show up on Instagram today. It’s. It’s okay to, to put those

[00:26:29] Jeff Sieh: boundaries up and it’s important to train.

[00:26:31] Oh, Grace went away. So, um, are you still there, Grace? Because I just see a, oh, no, Grace. Grace. How are you? Oh, she, oh well. So anyway, boundaries. One of the things that she’s like, Nope. Done. Yeah, she’s done. She’s like, this is her do not disturb sign. When I see this, I know that Grace is not available. This is her.

[00:26:49] Yes. But, uh, one of the things that, um, I think is important too is training your clients to have breaks. Like saying like, Hey, I’m not gonna be, yeah. I mean, I’m in the mornings are mine. I’ll be available for you in the afternoons or whatever. But doing that from the very beginning, a hundred percent. Yeah.

[00:27:04] So Robert, uh, Lee over on LinkedIn says this. He goes, number one, step away, uh, number two, build redundancies. Mm-hmm. and have other programs you can either replay or stagger releases to give you time to read. And three says, new solution I’ve seen others use is to have a backup post to fill in. Which is a great idea.

[00:27:18] And we have actually done that, uh, here on this show. So, uh, Uh, very cool. Thanks for those, Robert, over on LinkedIn. So, um, yeah, by the way, uh, real quick, the, the show is sponsored by our friends over. If you can’t tell or not, we’re big fans of Ecamm, not just because they sponsor the show , but they’re super smart.

[00:27:38] If you could look in the comments, you see that they’re, you know, they’re smart, they’re funny, they have a good time. So not only is it a great, incredible product, it’s also an incredible community. I, I use Ecamm m as a, um, example on how to build community because they do such a great job, even with Doc in there.

[00:27:55] I mean, they do a great job. Uh, running docs funny. So, but you can find out more socialmedianewslive.com/ecamm slash m bunch of cool new stuff coming out. So make sure you check. Go ahead. Gracious at Jeff

[00:28:07] Grace Duffy: being brave

[00:28:07] Jeff Sieh: on the internet, . Oh yeah, I know. He’s take forever to get here and pumble me. Um, cause he’s

[00:28:13] Katie Fawkes: That’s true.

[00:28:13] That’s true. Long flight.

[00:28:15] Grace Duffy: Yeah. Well, I’m back. Sorry about that. My camera decided to take a break. It was like, that’s all,

[00:28:19] Jeff Sieh: was like, we were talking about taking a break and we

[00:28:21] did. So, okay. Yeah, this is super important. We need to talk about this as well. Um, monetization, like everybody needs to make. We all wanna do this, but Grace, uh, you have found even more stats because you’re amazing.

[00:28:35] So, , this

[00:28:36] Katie Fawkes: Grace has got the stats. I love it.

[00:28:38] Grace Duffy: According to Influencer Marketing Hub, the creator economy was valued at 16.4 billion at the end of 2022, and it is still continuing to grow. Yet only 5% of creators actually earn a living from their content, directly from their content according to another study, as we’ve talked about earlier, we’ve talked about in previous shows, it’s like a lot of creators are making money other ways, but not necessarily directly from the.

[00:29:06] What we’re seeing or what other people are seeing online, and this is something that everyone is very curious about, is how, uh, content creators can partner or work together with brands in a mutually beneficial way to help support their personal brands and to also move the brand goals forward. Many creators are hoping to drift away from this transactional one-off paid projects as we’ve seen in like with influencers and things, and exchange for something more long-term, more collaborative, lasting partnerships, lasting relationships that help them grow their own business and, and also help the um, Brands that they’re helping, but they’re also looking to be treated fairly and to be compensated appropriately.

[00:29:47] Meanwhile, businesses want to work with good creators to help drive their goals and make these partnerships worthwhile in investments, which is crucial to the long-term success and stability of the entire creator economy. But it is increasingly necessary that we bridge this gap between, is there a gap?

[00:30:05] I don’t know, but between what brands want and then what, what, what audience and how to reach this audience who’s using creators. And as we mentioned at the top of the show, Katie, you work alongside some of the best and most amazing live streamers and creator content creators in the industry, helping them reach their goals and grow their businesses with video marketing and live Streaming.

[00:30:25] As this industry continues to grow and tries to harness the creator economy and media evolves, what is the next priority? Let’s, let’s take it from the brand perspective. What is the best priority next priorities for marketers to help Bridges gap that we are seeing as more and more necessary to reach their

[00:30:40] Katie Fawkes: audiences?

[00:30:43] what is the priority for marketers? Yeah, I, it’s, um, it’s a good question. I mean, I think it’s really understanding where creators are coming from. Like, as you said there, there’s sort of this, there’s been this shift from, you know, influencers where it was like, I’m gonna hire this, you know, influencer for a specific project or campaign to, you know, this really strong desire from the creator economy, from the creator space to wanna do more of these kinds of long-term partnerships.

[00:31:16] I would say marketing professionals. haven’t necessarily quite caught up to that yet. So there’s probably gonna be this level of education and, you know, and relationship building that is gonna be really necessary for creators in order to hit their goals and to get where they want to be. So I, I guess to, to flip the question, I would say marketers by and large are, are pretty behind on that.

[00:31:42] And many of them, you know, struggle with, uh, you know, even if they get it and really understand and believe in the vision, it’s hard to sell up to a management team or to a C-suite. So, you know, really kind of, I guess as we’re speaking directly to creators, understanding where a marketing team or a marketing professional is coming from is gonna be really necessary if you want to win in this space.

[00:32:06] Right. And figure out better ways to monetize.

[00:32:09] Jeff Sieh: So I, so I wanna pull up this comment from, from Doc, cuz of course, once again he has no opinions, but his marketers need to learn how to market in the modern marketplace. Yes. They’re out here still trying to do old stuff. Right. I totally agree. So, Um, what do you think, you know, we talked about at the beginning of the show, like, you’re not gonna start a podcast in, unless you get super, super lucky.

[00:32:32] It’s like winning the lottery. Like you start getting, you know, huge brand sponsorships. It’s a long-term thing. I think of people like Eric Fisher, who’s, I think it’s almost done it for 10 years. Uh, and he’s, you know, he’s got great sponsorships. He’s made, you know, partners with like Apple, uh, MasterCard. I mean all that stuff happens.

[00:32:48] But he has a long, it was a long term. I mean, he was there when Yeah, 10 years is a long time to be a podcast. Yeah. Uh, same with Lou Manillo. He’s got a incredible community with his w DW radio, but he started back like almost 20 years ago, I think, with that. And so it’s a long play. So what are some ways that, um, you know, for live streamers and video markers in 2023 that you see some opportunities for them to make some deals and make some money and maybe monetize in a certain way?

[00:33:18] Katie Fawkes: Yeah, I, I mean, I guess I would, I would say, and this is probably gonna make me , I’m sorry, I’m sorry everyone out there watching and listening, but I would say that we need to, as creators change that conversation. I think, again, you know, marketers by and large are sort of leery of this idea of, you know, long, a long.

[00:33:41] investment that is often really difficult to track. Mm-hmm. , you know, I would say that if you’re getting started and you’re really, and you don’t have that, you know, that longevity and kind of the pre, pre podcast explosion, , you know mm-hmm. state, uh, for your, for your show or for your podcast, then you should be starting with more than one monetization.

[00:34:04] Strategy at the back of your mind. So, you know, there are a lot of ways to quote unquote, monetize your show or yourself that go beyond just like finding a brand partner and doing these long-term sponsorships. And I would say that some of those smaller, easier ways to get started are going to make you more appealing to those marketers.

[00:34:24] So, you know, whether that’s like what you guys are doing with this show and you’re, you know, exploring out into, um, live selling and live shopping on platforms like Amazon, that could be like what Doc is doing, where, you know, building, um, leveraging community and, and the fan base that he’s building into, uh, a paid community and offering, you know, additional trainings and support, uh, for those, you know, for those folks.

[00:34:45] Um, that could be something as simple as, um, selling, you know, additional. , uh, you know, products or services in and alongside your show. So using your show, um, more as kind of a marketing vehicle. Mm-hmm. , but I, you know, I would say that that kind of having more than one option is gonna be really important.

[00:35:06] And when it comes to sponsorship, I, I am a big believer in you. You’re gonna need to build a really good relationship with that brand or that business and really understand not only what their needs are, but like what their, you know, what their marketing strategies are as Doc said. Like, you know, maybe they’re a little bit behind, or maybe they’re ahead and they’re willing to, you know, to try some things.

[00:35:29] And you might need to take on some of those kind of smaller one-off projects or, you know, or do some things, um, for free or for, you know, for affiliate revenue that, um, to prove yourself and to really show the value of that relationship and partnership. It’ll be an easier conversation down the road to be able to extend out to, you know, Testing out or trying, uh, a larger sponsorship.

[00:35:51] So there’s a bunch of options out there. I think it’s easy, easiest, and we all have in our minds that like, we just want a monthly sponsor for, you know, two monthly sponsors for forever. But I think that there’s a bunch of options out there to get, to get to that level and a bunch of options that might even be more successful for you and what you’re doing than a sponsorship.

[00:36:08] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. So I wanted to, to doc, we mentioned his course and some of the things he’s doing, doc, I’m gonna offer him a knowledge branch so he doesn’t pumble me the next time he sees me. . Um, doc, feel free to put your link to your course in the comments below. Cause we’ve had you on, you’ve talked about that before, so that’d be great.

[00:36:22] People interested in that. Um, the other thing, just to be transparent, and I want to talk about this, what you were talking about, what brand, you know, what brands look for, like, what you look for in Ecamm m like when you wanna partner with somebody or be a sponsor at a podcasting conference or whatever.

[00:36:37] Mm-hmm. , uh, I wanna know your thoughts about that, but I wanted to be a little transparent about like, what we do here is I as a, uh, uh, creator, I am very like, I’m. I mean, I’m bothered Katie and Slack all the time. Like, Hey, what do you want me to, to push this week? I mean, you have, you can’t just ha it is a relationship, it’s a long-term relationship where you, you trust each other and trust is built over time.

[00:36:59] And it’s not just, Hey, give me my paycheck every week. That’s not, I don’t think that’s gonna work when you first start, or ever. Mm-hmm. . You wanna have these long-term relationships where you’re constantly giving them ideas. They’re, you’re helping them out with, you know, promotions or whatever, but you have to keep being involved.

[00:37:15] And I think that’s the key that has to happen. But what, what do you look for in a brand or a, a conference or where you go spend your time, you know, promoting what makes a creator attractive to a brand? Say like Ecamm.

[00:37:27] Katie Fawkes: Oh my gosh. I first off, I love that you said that because I have said multiple, multiple times behind the scenes without you listening, Jeff , that honestly, I feel as though I’m not really, or Ecamm is not really sponsoring this show.

[00:37:41] I see that financial arrangement much more in the, the benefits of it, much more in the relationships. Um, the relationship I have with you, Jeff. Mm-hmm. , but also the relationships that you bring to us. So like, you are, you are, you’re constantly sort of letting us know about things that you’re seeing out there, and that’s in the space you’re introducing us to, you know, other creators that might, uh, you know, that might want to know us and work with us.

[00:38:07] You’re letting us know about events you’re like, it’s, it is, I am sort of tracking, I guess, quote unquote, much more than just, you know, how many subscribers, you know, is this show bringing us in as a business. Right? Right. But that’s been a learning progress, you know, a learning process for me as well. Um, And I, I guess to answer the main question that you asked is, is that, you know, Ecamm specifically is a really small business, so we actually don’t do hardly any sponsorships.

[00:38:34] Mm-hmm. , mm-hmm. . Um, we do a lot of events and we work on a lot of, um, video content projects with people. Right. So we do a lot of mini-series and, um, virtual events and things like that, that we hire from within our own kind of group of creators. Um, and I’m, I’m really always looking for people that have built a relationship with me, um, you know, without asking for anything in exchange, right.

[00:38:56] So the people who have like, you know, showed up with ideas or, you know, or suggested features or just like, told me more about what they’re doing and, and like what they love or don’t love about it, you know, really kind of gone outta their way to understand what, you know, what Ecamm is looking for and how they fit in, you know, to our community.

[00:39:14] Um, and then those who have like a really clear vision for what they’re looking to accomplish. Like, I, I say this all the time to creators and some of them take my advice and others do not, but like, If you wanna get into this space, you need to have a media kit. You need to have something that you can send these businesses that says what your value is, what your passion is, who your people are.

[00:39:36] What like, and this goes beyond just like, you know, I’ve, I have a podcast and I’ve been doing this for a year, and these are like my metrics. It should also go into like, you know, who, who are your people? What is your, that is your audience. Yeah. Vision. Yeah. What, you know, what are the, some of the things that you do on a regular basis?

[00:39:50] Like, you know, are you the, a podcast host that also speaks at a ton of podcasting events or hosts a, you know, a podcasting like meetup group? Like, what, what is, what is your reach and what is your vision? And, and as a business, like, I’d like to be able to get to know you in that media, you know, kit mm-hmm.

[00:40:07] But I wanna, that’s easier for me to take a look at with, you know, with visuals and understand your brand than, you know, a cold email or a DM on LinkedIn or any of those different opportunities. And so few people, Have them, the amount of messages that that I get where they’re just like, you know, I’d really love to, I’d really love to partner with you or work with you, and, you know, and I’m why, yeah, why and who are you and like, and why?

[00:40:32] Like, you know, we, we have thousands of customers. So it’s, it’s without that kind of taking the time to build some kind of rapport with me and also, you know, having a, something that I can reference and look at or share with my team is just really difficult for me to even want to continue those conversations.

[00:40:48] So I, it’s more work. I get it, but also, you know, having a really good understanding of what you as a creator wanna get out of it and what value you bring to the brand partner you wanna work with is, Huge. Without it, you’re not gonna win. Yep. Carrie, I’m sorry. Love that,

[00:41:04] Jeff Sieh: Carrie. Yes. I noticed we both breed air.

[00:41:06] Let’s connect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let’s get LinkedIn.

[00:41:09] Katie Fawkes: Yeah. I get messages all the time. We’re like, Hey, we’re both HR professionals. We’re not. Yes. Or we both work in it also. No, like I just,

[00:41:17] Jeff Sieh: you know, it’s, that’s, so I let me know if this, I think this would be a good show topic. It’s like how to create a media kit.

[00:41:22] So if that’d be something you guys think would be great to do, let us know in the comments, because I think we can get some really good experts on who could teach us how to do that really, really well. But, uh, Grace, you wanted, there’s a, a great question I know you wanted to talk about, so, Let me pull it up.

[00:41:34] Oh, I

[00:41:34] Grace Duffy: was just gonna add the comment that this morning we got an email, Jeff, where someone was like pitching their content creation services to us and I was like, so you wanna hire us? And they’re like, no, we’re not hiring us .

[00:41:47] Jeff Sieh: It’s crazy. Yeah. So yeah,

[00:41:52] Katie Fawkes: one step above that guys, it’s like, I would like for you one step up from

[00:41:56] Grace Duffy: that.

[00:41:57] Yeah. I would like for you to like at least know who we are. , right That, and then pitch us. At least put my name in this email. Anyway. So let’s get to Jim’s question here and then I wanna read Doc’s response, but I wanna get your response too as well, Katie. So Jim asks, is there an advantage to being a truly creative thinker versus a highly analytical like me to beat the competition?

[00:42:19] And doc’s response to this was Jim. I was born analytical. I put that dude in the basement and went creative. The only algorithm are analysts that need. . I need our, my community numbers cause knee jerk reactions. People are real and better

[00:42:33] Jeff Sieh: and, and I think being analytical is creativity in a different direction.

[00:42:37] Agree. I I just think everybody is creative. I’m sorry, but Katie, what

[00:42:41] Katie Fawkes: are your thoughts? No, I, I completely agree and I was gonna say like, I think you can, I, I agree. And then I also love doc’s comment because I, I think it’s a, it’s a mix of both. So I would say if you’re highly analytical and you’re like super numbers driven and you really wanna be able to, to show that, whether it’s an immediate kit or just.

[00:42:57] In, in general, like show, you know, show quotes and, and think about different kinds of metrics that you, that you can show that matter more to people. We’ve been talking for most of this episode about the fact that everyone has these kinds of magic numbers in the back of our head, and so on both sides of that conversation we’re gonna need to readjust and have honest conversations about what’s realistic.

[00:43:20] So in the same way that all of us wanna have, you know, a million subscribers and a million views and a million dollars in the bank account, you know, businesses also, you know, want to sell a million subscriptions and do, uh, so, you know, so they, some of those numbers, even if they’re realistic, are gonna be hard for a lot of us to put down.

[00:43:38] It’s like, oh, you know, I only have a hundred, you know, regular listeners to my podcast. Okay. Like a better analytical approach to that would. Introducing in some way in that media kit, you know who those people are or sharing quotes or say, like if you have a hundred people and you have a, a soda, you know, you’re talking about soda every single week.

[00:43:59] Mm-hmm. , but a hundred of them, you know, 50 work for Dr. Pepper and the other 50 work for Pepsi . Great. Like, those are like the right people for that, you know, for that podcast. And those people know a ton of other people and maybe they have, you know, a lot of different relationships. So I think you. I think you can pull different data out, and I think that would be the, the creative approach to being an analytical person.

[00:44:21] Jeff Sieh: Right? Every, we need both kinds is what I would say. Yeah. So, yep. Grace, you had a great, uh, question, a thing about the, uh, note you wanted to talk to the audience about. I thought that was really good. So I’ll let you say that because you, the flip side one? No, the audience engagement thing that we, we, that you put in there about Oh,

[00:44:37] Grace Duffy: I said think it’s added this.

[00:44:38] Yeah. Okay. I added this note. I said the world needs your unique voice and perspective, so keep creating and sharing your work with the world. That is my message to our audience. Yes. And

[00:44:46] Jeff Sieh: I, I think the creator made us all creative, so I think we could be, yes. Like I think accountants are creative with numbers.

[00:44:52] I think everybody has. A story

[00:44:54] Grace Duffy: to tell you don’t want you accountant to be too creative with your numbers now ass.

[00:44:59] Jeff Sieh: You know what I mean? But every, but any, any, you can be creative in any industry. Um, yeah. So, oh gosh, yeah. Now I’m gonna get audited, but go ahead. No,

[00:45:08] Katie Fawkes: I, I know we’re tight on time, but, uh, but yeah, I, like, I, we get this, we get this question a lot actually, so I just wanna throw this out there, like, people who are like, oh, you know, I’m in x, y, Z field and I couldn’t possibly do a podcast or a live Restream or a show because, like, it, it’s a super boring industry.

[00:45:26] Like it’s, you know, like, I’m like a, I’m a lawyer, a plumber, whatever. I. I am blown away by the content and the following, and the, just the overall quality of, of podcasts and of live videos from, you know, from our customers and, and folks who are not our customers who are just out there sharing helpful information.

[00:45:47] You know, we, there’s a live Streaming lawyer who is one of our customers. Oh, yeah, yeah. He’s a Canadian immigration lawyer, which is like as dry as it comes for everyone but me. , and, and, but he, you know, but those are questions that when you need the answer to those questions, you just don’t even know where to go.

[00:46:03] You’re like, I don’t, I can’t, like who do I hire? I, I don’t wanna spend money to just ask a really quick question is why. And so he’s their lives for me answering everyone’s questions. So every time someone is searching for that information, right, he comes up and they are getting to know him week after week, after.

[00:46:18] He is not what you would normally consider to be someone that’s like overly creative and, you know, coming in with like, you know, dances during the countdowns and like fun graphics sliding in, right? Like, he’s not what we would traditionally be like a YouTuber, but he’s killing it out there and he’s getting tons of new customers and because he’s out there helping people and sharing his knowledge and his expertise in, in the format in the medium where people are looking for that information.

[00:46:45] So, yeah. Um, yeah. It’s, it’s worth it to, to be out there. Agreed.

[00:46:50] Grace Duffy: Oh, I feel like he probably gets a spike in his content approximately every two to four years, right?

[00:46:56] Katie Fawkes: So

[00:46:59] Grace Duffy: outta here.

[00:46:59] Katie Fawkes: Yeah. I’m gonna

[00:47:00] Jeff Sieh: keep it at that. So I, I was actually doing research for a, a client, a research for a client that, um, he was a, he was a construction dirt work guy and I did, there’s like four or five podcasts on moving Dirt.

[00:47:12] and they’re huge. There’s a huge YouTube channel where a guy goes around and just films big machines, moving dirt, and it’s like millions of subscribers. I’m like, yeah, there is a place for everyone. You cannot say people getting, yeah, you cannot say your, um,

[00:47:24] Grace Duffy: your, uh, there’s, there is content for every, there’s a, there’s a niche for

[00:47:28] Jeff Sieh: everyone.

[00:47:28] So speaking of, uh, creating content, I wanna talk about the flow. Podcast because it is also a video podcast. And this came out today from Pod News and I wanted to share it with you guys because it was a survey that just came out and it said 46% of podcast listeners now say they prefer consuming them with video compared to 42%.

[00:47:50] Who said they would rather listen without video. Now this is from Pod News today. I we’re hitting that tipping point right before um, the show came out. It was an article came out. So, and people are discovering podcasts on YouTube. I think it’s right up there with Apple. Mm-hmm. And some, and Spotify. So video is becoming more and more important and I want to give that out there because your show is all about that.

[00:48:10] And if you haven’t checked it out yet, you can actually go to the flow dot Ecamm dot com right down below there. Make sure you go listen to that. Um, give a great rating and review because that really does help podcasting out. But talk to us about, you’ve done a year of the flow. Talk to us about what it is, what the, the whole thing is about and why, um, you’re continuing to do it,

[00:48:34] Katie Fawkes: So we started the flow predominantly because we, uh, as an Ecamm marketing team we’re, we’re moving more into the podcasting market. So we were saying, you know, we’re seeing this huge rise in podcasters starting to, you know, to explore adding video to their podcasts. They’re more and more of these platforms are adding video podcasts in, you know, there’s this, there’s lots of questions coming in, and Doc, who is my co-host on the show knows literally everything about this space, and I know nothing about this space.

[00:49:06] So I was like, well, what if we came up with this concept of, you know, of a show where we’re literally going to have. , the, the, our target audience, you know, who, who’s like, I have questions, but I don’t really know if they’re good questions or bad questions that, you know, bounce these ideas and these topics off of Doc who can, you know, bring these, um, insights to life and talk through the process and really explain what the value is behind it.

[00:49:28] And then obviously we have, you know, guests, um, who join us and we do a lot of case studies, um, in our, you know, moving forward into this. But yeah, the whole concept really was came out of this idea of we need to put our money, wear our mouths are, or vice versa, and be able to really, you know, if we’re, if we’re gonna be real in this space, we need to be doing it ourselves.

[00:49:49] And we need to understand like where the pain points are and the challenges are and how effective is Ecamm at letting us do this. So, uh, it’s been a really great journey. I feel actually after six-ish months of doing it, that. , I feel, I feel like I can be on shows like this and answer a ton of questions about podcasting and about, you know, what, what the process is.

[00:50:08] And that’s just from going there and asking dumb questions and researching and being okay with the fact that, you know, maybe my mike, you know, was sent to the wrong thing and Doc Live, you know, on the show tells me like what I’ve done wrong or like my camera goes out, or I mm-hmm. , I, I’m calling it Failing Forward and I’m, there you go.

[00:50:26] I’m doing it now publicly. I’m just failing forward publicly for everyone to watch. But it’s been a really great experience for me and I hope it’s been a great experience for everyone watching to, to know that. It’s okay to learn in public and you’re gonna get better every single episode. Yeah. And people really love watching the process.

[00:50:44] So, um, it’s a process podcast and it’s been a lot of fun. So, um, Jeff

[00:50:48] Grace Duffy: and I have been very transparent about the fact that this show, the one that we do every week

[00:50:52] Katie Fawkes: going forward consulting.

[00:50:53] Jeff Sieh: It’s free consulting. It’s, and also you, you stole my whole strategy of asking stupid questions because Grace has to clean those up for me.

[00:51:01] No, I ask them. You are the one who gets I do not. I do a That’s right. I do great questions. What do you say? I write your questions. So Gary says, uh, and he has a podcast too, I know that he’s done, but he says, uh, Ecamm makes the podcast workflow effortless if you didn’t know if you’re a podcaster, like we record this and we actually have everybody on separate tracks.

[00:51:21] So it makes it super easy to level stuff out, trim it up, all the cool stuff. Um, so, uh, e m is amazing for producing a podcast and a video podcast at the same time, so, yep. Um, What do you, when you’re interviewing these creators, what do you, what are you wanting to, you know, is there certain criteria you’re trying to get for the show?

[00:51:39] I mean, are you looking for just a variety of different creators that you pull in and ask questions? Is that how you, how you do it?

[00:51:45] Katie Fawkes: That’s a great question. Um, so we’re, we’re getting, we’re newer to the guest, uh, you know, bringing guests onto the show and we, so we have kind of two different. Perspectives on it.

[00:51:56] Mm-hmm. and two different kind of sides to it that we’ve been doing. So one is, is just like a podcasting case study. So we’re bringing people on who either have had a really, you know, have been podcasting or video podcasting for a while mm-hmm. and either, you know, are adding video to their podcast or just talking through like what the experience has been like for them or they’re.

[00:52:14] Brand new and they’ve never done any kind of podcasting and we’re bringing them on to like literally help them live. Oh, that’s cool. Yeah. Work through flow, through like how they’re gonna get started and let them ask their questions and you know, and, and kind of think through and brainstorm through their challenges.

[00:52:27] And then we do have, um, and are hoping to get more on going forward, but, uh, you know, experts in various spaces. So, you know, we use a, again, tools as partners or tools as teammates, , right. We, we use a bunch of different tools to be successful, um, in what we do on the podcast. So, you know, looking to bring more of experts, um, from those tools or just experts in different aspects of podcasting to come on and, and dive deep into like a specific topic.

[00:52:52] Like, you know, how do you pull up transcript for a podcast? Or how do you edit a podcast or see some of these things that, um, are pain points or our questions or challenges people have.

[00:53:02] Jeff Sieh: Yeah, that’s, it’s a great, it’s a great show and, and Doc is, yeah, he does know. Don’t tell him I said that, but he does know

[00:53:08] He does know pretty much everything when it comes to that stuff. Yes. Grace, she had a question too, which is I think is really. Really cool. Um, because I think it is a big deal when you’re both.

[00:53:17] Grace Duffy: Yeah. So I wanted to ask you, what is the biggest challenge? Because now you’ve been doing this for six months. We did round up to a year, but six months

[00:53:24] What is the biggest challenge when you’re toggling between two different mindsets? You’re the director of marketing over at Ecamm, but you’re also a creator in this arena. So how do you juggle those two different mindsets when you’re going after, uh, these interviews and, and, uh, and pulling back the curtain a little bit, cause I think a lot of people honestly do not understand or don’t realize because they haven’t been around it, what it takes to make an income or to be a creator.

[00:53:51] So I’d love to know how you balance those two things.

[00:53:54] Katie Fawkes: Yeah, I, it’s a work in progress. I, I think it makes me more. I think putting myself out there, and I’ve felt this way from the first day that I that I started at Ecamm, but putting my, putting myself out there on video is going to make me a more effective marketing manager, marketing director, um, because I’ll understand what the challenges are of our customers and you know, I’m, it, it’s a really, it’s an interesting, and in some ways a really unique space to be in because, you know, our, we almost have a reverse problem from a lot of other businesses.

[00:54:32] You know, we, we don’t have an issue getting Ecamm out there. We, all of our customers are creators who love the software and who are talking about it on a regular basis. So, you know, if I, but they do have challenges with, you know, a feature that doesn’t work the way that they think or trying to find something in the app or, you know, all these different things.

[00:54:52] So I think being out there and kind of. In some ways pretending to be a creator until I really was a creator. has helped me, has helped me figure out a lot of where, where creators are coming from and what, you know, what their challenges are and what is important to them, and where those pain points are.

[00:55:08] That helps those discussions, particularly about monetization, uh, makes those discussions a lot easier for me as a marketing director because I, I get it. I, I understand that they’re, you know, they’re trying to be successful. I get what their goals are. I get, you know, how it feels to, you know, have a mic go out or hear like a what you think is an echo or have, you know, something horribly wrong.

[00:55:29] I, I know because I’ve, I’ve been there for those situations , so I understand where people are coming from, from that and how important a lot of these, you know, a lot of these productions are, so how important it is to have certain features or how important it is for the software to work every time. Right, right.

[00:55:45] Because, so I, I really see myself as, you know, wearing those two hats allows me also to be a really effective middleman between, Our, all of our customers and the, and the creator space and our two developers who, you know, are just like focused into the development of the app and aren’t Streaming on a regular basis.

[00:56:03] So sometimes they’re like, you know, like, is it really all that important for us to Amazon Live comments? And I’m like, yes, it is . I’ve talked to a bunch of our creators. So the, you know, that side of it I think is also really important. Well,

[00:56:13] Jeff Sieh: that, I mean, that’s cool. It’s like, you know, yeah. What is that old thing?

[00:56:16] It’s like, I’m not just a president, I’m also a member, you know, the hair club for men thing. Um, but, but also that you, you’re in the trenches and that, you know, like this takes time. It’s not like, you know, uh, we’re doing this and we’re instantly have a gazillion downloads you, like, you see the, the process and the struggle and all the things that come with it.

[00:56:36] And I can’t remember who said it, but it was like, what, 90% of success is just showing. It’s just showing up. Yeah. It’s just being consistent. And most podcasts, I think the stats are, they stop after seven episodes. Yeah. And so once you get past the 10, the twenties, the thirties, then, then, then I think you have success compared to a lot of people.

[00:56:54] What are you laughing about?

[00:56:55] Grace Duffy: Yeah. That eight years later you’re still with Jeff. So, you know, like

[00:57:00] Jeff Sieh: my beard was a lot darker back in the day. And, uh, doc says this, which is great, says vulnerability is a superpower. People are tired of the bulletproof persona of the gurus. Gurus all get painfully exposed.

[00:57:11] Being the Wizard of Oz so often now raw and real works well these days. So very, very true. Uh, so Katie, this has been fabulous. We have to do this, uh, way sooner than we did this time because this is a lot of fun. But I want you to be able to, uh, talk a little bit about like, some cool stuff coming up with Ecamm.

[00:57:29] that, that, yeah. I dunno if, you know, we’re excited about Ecamm. Um, but uh, I’d love for you to talk about that a little bit. Yeah.

[00:57:37] Katie Fawkes: So, uh, lots going on at Ecamm and if you’ve been hanging out with us, uh, in our community and in our discord, you will know that we have been head down locked, Ken and Glenn in a closet, and we are getting super close to rolling out Ecamm 4.0, um, this month, coming super, super soon.

[00:57:56] So, um, it includes a ton of just incredible features. So, um, among them we already talked about Amazon, which literally is new. You know, got that up and running so quickly, which was super exciting for us. Uh, multi Streaming is now, um, a feature within Ecamm m so if you’ve been, you know, um, really looking for that as a tool that is now, uh, built into 4.0, there’s a whole new camera switcher and Oh yeah.

[00:58:22] Kind of the main, um, functionality within Ecamm M is, uh, just now much easier to use, better define, let’s you really leverage all of those incredible tools. You spent all your Christmas money on . We, we got you . We’re here to support you in that. Um, and you know, re and again, you were mentioning this sort of in passing earlier, but, um, you know, Ecamm has really over the last few years, developed past just being this, you know, really powerful, uh, live Streaming tool and really is a tool that you can keep on.

[00:58:53] all the time. Mm-hmm. , because you can use it in every aspect of what you’re doing. You know, if you wanna record like, uh, your Zoom meeting, you can do that with Ecamm on through our virtual camera. You know, you can run pre presentations in webinars and meetings and a number of different tools. Uh, you can record, you know, all your vertical video to use across all those different social platforms.

[00:59:14] Um, and it’s got this. Um, feature within it, uh, called ISO Video Isolated video, which is the, oh, it’s so awesome, partnered to our audio. So if, you know, as you get better or if you’re starting off as a production person, it just really gives you, you know, a ton of different video footage. So, you know, in this case it would be like, you would have the video, uh, of, you know, of the three of us with our, with the cool backgrounds and all of the, um, awesomeness that is the show.

[00:59:39] But you’d also have my video, you know, clean separate. You would have Grace’s video clean and separate Jeff’s video, clean and separate audio for each one of those so that you could really, you know, seem those together in post-production and editing and be able to create all kinds of different video content or, you know, a really, um, really high quality video.

[00:59:57] Uh, Yeah. End results. So yeah, lots of really thinking through kind of Ecamm as this just full production studio. So, you know, again, if you, if you can be clever and just leave it on in the background, you can create pitch decks, you can send video memos, you can, you can be real annoying on video across every,

[01:00:15] Jeff Sieh: every aspect.

[01:00:16] So you, you touch, you don’t understand how as a, because I’m a big repurposer, you know how important those iso trucks are Always be rolling . Oh my gosh. Because like when I, when I film a, uh, like an, I’ll give you an example. Amazon product video. So I have the top down and I have my little cam my face in there, and now I can capture all of that and I can repurpose it as reels.

[01:00:36] I can repurpose it as, uh, you know, vertical video and all this stuff because I have all the content separate. I don’t please understand how important that that is. Amazing. Folks, you gotta check it out. It’s coming in 4.0. You can find out more at Social Media News Live dot. Slash e m. Yep. Thank you guys so much for being here.

[01:00:53] Thank you for sticking with us. Um, Grace, where can people find out all about? All about Grace?

[01:00:58] Grace Duffy: Duffy? I’m here every week, Jeff, except when I’m not. Our next show is Friday, January 20th at 11:00 AM Eastern, 10:00 AM central and we will be here, Facebook, LinkedIn, YouTube and Amazon Live. So excited. This was a great show.

[01:01:13] Yes, Katie, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks so much. Thank

[01:01:15] Katie Fawkes: you for Doc

[01:01:16] Jeff Sieh: Rocking and Gary and Robert and all you folks who, and Dustin and everybody who left great comments today on the show. We appreciate you. We, we wouldn’t be able to do the show without you. And with that, we’ll see you guys next time.

[01:01:27] Thank you so much, Katie, for being here. And with that, we’ll see you guys. Bye. Bye everybody. Bye. Bye bye.

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