🔔 Join us as we welcome back Paul Gowder for an in-depth discussion on “Building An Email List in 2024.”

Dive into the world of email marketing as Paul shares his extensive experience and strategies for growing your email list. We’ll discuss the latest tools, tactics, and what’s on the horizon for email marketing in the new year.

Catch Paul’s valuable insights for marketers and entrepreneurs looking to enhance their reach! 🚀

Introduction: The Vital Role of Email Marketing in 2024

In the dynamic digital landscape of 2024, email marketing continues to play a crucial role in connecting brands with their audiences. Paul Gowder, the innovative mind behind PowWows.com, brings his extensive experience to the forefront, offering valuable strategies for those looking to enhance their email marketing. His approach combines traditional marketing wisdom with modern techniques, making it relevant and effective in today’s fast-paced digital environment.

Paul Gowder’s Comprehensive Approach to Building an Email List

Paul’s approach to building an email list is rooted in the fundamental principle of creating genuine connections and delivering real value to subscribers. He emphasizes a step-by-step strategy that focuses on the basics while adapting to the evolving digital marketing landscape.

Step 1: Starting with the Basics – Asking for Emails

Building an email list starts with the basic yet crucial step of asking for emails. Paul Gowder highlights various opportunities to ask for emails, such as through engaging website content, interactive social media posts, and during podcasts. He underscores the importance of being transparent about the benefits of subscribing, such as exclusive content or unique insights, to encourage audience sign-ups.

Step 2: Leveraging Drip Campaigns for Engagement

Drip campaigns are a key component in nurturing new subscribers. Paul advises using these automated sequences to gradually introduce subscribers to the brand’s story and values. He suggests balancing informational content with promotional messages to maintain subscriber interest and engagement.

Step 3: The Art of Crafting Engaging Content

Engaging content is at the heart of successful email marketing. Paul Gowder stresses the importance of personalization and storytelling in email content. He encourages sharing behind-the-scenes stories, solutions to common problems, and industry insights to create emails that subscribers look forward to receiving.

Step 4: Choosing the Right Tools and Strategies

Selecting the right tools and strategies is critical for the success of an email marketing campaign. He discusses the merits of various platforms like ConvertKit and MailChimp, noting their capabilities in managing email lists, crafting campaigns, and analyzing results. He emphasizes the importance of choosing tools that not only meet the current needs of the business but also have the potential to scale as the business grows.

Additionally, he advises on the necessity of leveraging analytics to track key metrics such as open rates, click-through rates, and subscriber engagement levels, enabling marketers to make informed decisions based on data.

Step 5: The Strategic Use of Giveaways

Paul Gowder has found significant success in using giveaways to enhance email list growth. He advocates for offering relevant and desirable incentives that align with the brand and resonate with the target audience. Such giveaways not only attract new subscribers but also engage and excite the existing audience. He points out that the effectiveness of giveaways lies in their ability to create a buzz around the brand while providing value to the audience.

Step 6: Adapting and Evolving with the Audience

In the ever-changing landscape of email marketing, Gowder stresses the importance of adaptability. Regularly reviewing and refreshing email strategies based on performance metrics and audience feedback is crucial. He discusses the value of audience segmentation, tailoring content to different segments based on their behaviors and preferences, to ensure more relevant and impactful communication.

Building Deeper Connections Through Email Marketing

Paul Gowder places a strong emphasis on treating email subscribers as a community rather than just a list. Engaging with subscribers through personalization, direct interaction, and encouraging feedback are central to his approach. This strategy fosters a sense of belonging and loyalty among the audience, turning subscribers into brand advocates.

Conclusion: Embracing the Future of Email Marketing

Paul’s insights highlight the enduring power and potential of email marketing. In a digital marketing world where personalization and authenticity are increasingly valued, email marketing offers a unique opportunity to build meaningful relationships with an audience. His approach, combining the fundamentals of traditional marketing with the innovations of the digital age, provides a roadmap for businesses to effectively use email marketing to connect with their audience, build a community, and drive growth.

By understanding the audience, creating engaging content, leveraging the right tools, and remaining adaptable to changes, marketers can navigate the challenges of the digital landscape and harness the full potential of email marketing. In 2024 and beyond, email marketing remains an indispensable tool in the digital marketer’s toolkit, offering unparalleled opportunities for personal connection and brand growth.


This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

[00:00:00] Jeff Sieh: Hello folks, welcome to Social Media News Live. I’m Jeff Sieh, and you’re not.

[00:00:04] And this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the world of social media and so much more. And maybe you’ve wondered what it takes to truly master the art of email marketing. Maybe you’re curious about the strategies that propel an email list to new heights or maybe you want to transform your communication into a tool for growth.

[00:00:23] If that’s something that has crossed your mind, then we’ve got a great episode for you today. We’re excited to welcome a guest who has navigated these waters with great, great skill. He is an expert in crafting compelling email campaigns and growing vibrant online communities. In fact, his Powwow’s Facebook page just crossed over a million followers.

[00:00:43] Paul Gouder will be unveiling his strategies and his invaluable tips for email marketing success. So sit back, clear your schedule, clear your mind, and get ready for this week’s episode of Social Media News Live. Paul, how are you doing today, my friend?

[00:00:57] Paul Gowder: I’m great. It’s a, it’s a great day. I’m really excited for 2024. And I do a lot with email myself, but 2024, I am doubling down and really focusing even more on email. It’s going to be so important this year.

[00:01:08] Jeff Sieh: I don’t know how you could do that, because you have killed it on email. So if you don’t know Paul, let me introduce you to him. Paul Gowder is the owner and founders of powwows. com, which has been the leading online community celebrating Native American culture for the past 25 years. He’s visited hundreds of powwows across North America, and he’s been able to capture those events and publish them to millions of viewers on his website and YouTube channel.

[00:01:32] And having experienced the trials and tribulations of running A successful online community for the past 25 years. Paul helps other entrepreneurs navigate the success and pitfalls of building an online business through his public speaking and consulting services. You can find out more aboutPaul@paulgower.com.

[00:01:49] In fact, I remember when we were at Momentum, Paul, that you were still working like a day job like, and you like this. You have gone full time, like was it the past two years? Is that what it is?

[00:02:00] Paul Gowder: Yeah, yeah, this is year two, I think.

[00:02:02] Jeff Sieh: Wow, that is amazing. So, before we jump into it, I want to do a shout out to our sponsor, Ecamm. They are what makes this, show possible.

[00:02:11] You can find out more about them at socialmedianewslive. com forward slash Ecamm. I don’t know why my lower third’s weird there, but we’ll fix that later. but find out more about them, socialmedianewslive. com Ecamm. Once I, once again, I said that, they’re going to be there with us at the Podfest meetup that’s sponsored by Ecamm and Mediavine.

[00:02:28] You guys need to go check it out because it’s going to be so much fun. You get to hang out with me and Paul and Ecamm and talk, shop, ride some rides, eat some foods. It’s going to be amazing. JeffSieh. com forward slash podfest meetup. So let’s dive into starting email marketing because I want to talk about because a lot of people.

[00:02:47] you know, they say, build your list, build your list, it’s, you know, that’s the only thing you own, and, and people really don’t get, like, where to get started. I remember, I was lucky enough when I first started way back in the Google mainly Pinterest tips days, that somebody told me, like, and so I just made a call to actually the end of my podcast, and it’s like, sign up for my newsletter, and I did it, and I’m glad I did, but I really didn’t do anything for it.

[00:03:09] So, as someone with all this experience in community building, Paul, What’s the fundamental first steps you would recommend to someone who’s just starting with email marketing? Mm hmm.

[00:03:21] Paul Gowder: Yeah, I think it’s, it’s one of those things that everybody knows they should be doing, but I think a lot of people are scared to take that first step. So I would say that one of the first things you want to do is, is just what you did, right? Ask for people’s emails. Even if you don’t have your backend set up, don’t worry about all that stuff.

[00:03:38] Maybe just create an email, a spreadsheet or a simple form on your website, but make sure you’re asking for email in everything you do, whether you’re writing an article on your website or publishing a podcast or an Instagram reel, give up, give people a way to send them, send you their email. That’s so important.

[00:03:55] Just start building it now. And. You can figure out the rest later, but then the, the first thing, once you start asking for email, I think another place that people get bogged down is worrying about what they’re going to send and feeling the pressure of having to send out this, you know, email with all this value in it every week.

[00:04:15] And I think, I think you need to take a step back and don’t worry about the broadcast messages. You know, those are the ones you send out weekly, you know, whatever. Focus really on building your first. series of emails in email marketing. There are things called drip campaigns or sequences or whatever.

[00:04:31] It is just an automated series of emails. I think that’s the most important place to start. Build out and the first sequence you need to build is those first five points really, or, you know, three to five points of what your business is. Write a simple email campaign of here’s who I am. You know, maybe the second one is, my background.

[00:04:50] Maybe the third one is, Something I’m really good at. Or something my business does that nobody else does. and then, you know, in that just kind of go through your business, why you’re different, what makes you special, why people need to, you know, use your services, whatever it is, just write that, let that be the first thing that people.

[00:05:09] Kind of get when they get on your email list, then you can worry about the rest of the stuff later. But I think that’s really the main thing is just build a simple email sequence. That’s going to get, give everybody the same experience when you onboard them into your community. Give everybody that same, Hey, it’s your elevator pitch, right?

[00:05:26] Just write out your elevator pitch in three to five emails.

[00:05:29] Jeff Sieh: So that’s really interesting because, I, I, you know, I, we were tested in this contest that we’re doing. If you go to jeffsieh. com forward slash, podfest meetup, that right underneath the signup button, there’s a contest that we’re running to give away this free Disney ticket. The, the thing, because I did it with one of my kind of throwaway email accounts, and I got into your sequence.

[00:05:47] I think that’s how it is. And so. And it was like talking about who you are. And I did it wrong. Like when I first started, I was told like do a newsletter like once a week. and I’m really fascinated about these sequences, like for this initial sequence, if you’re just starting out, how, and you mentioned telling people about.

[00:06:04] You know, who you are, what you offer, your services, how many, how long does that go? And then at the end, what do you do? Because I think that’s what a lot of people get confused about. Like, okay, how many, like, is it three, three emails? Is it like a week long series? Like, how long should, and in depth should this be?

[00:06:21] And then what, what, what do I do when I’m done?

[00:06:24] Paul Gowder: right. And I think it depends, right?

[00:06:25] Jeff Sieh: Mm hmm.

[00:06:27] Paul Gowder: I know a guest on your show recently, that was her answer for a lot of things. It depends. It does. You know, it depends on where you are in your business, really. I mean, if you have, let’s use a Lou Mangiello. We’re all friends with Lou, right? Let’s take him, you know, he’s got his podcast, his website, his, his group cruises, his coaching in Momentum.

[00:06:49] That would maybe be a five, six. maybe even eight email series cause he’s got so much to offer. If you’re a little newer and maybe you just have a podcast and a coaching service that you do, maybe yours is shorter, maybe it’s only three or four emails. But just go through, you know, here is what who I am, here’s the service I offer.

[00:07:09] And I, in these, I try to keep these emails somewhat short, maybe one link, if any link at all, you know, if it’s, if you’re doing, the first one is, you know, here’s who I am and here’s, you know, kind of my background, maybe you link to something on your website that gives a more in depth bio, but these, these are short emails.

[00:07:28] You just want people to kind of know who you are and get that, That welcoming feeling. And then at the end of them, I think that’s where you make your call to action. Right? so if you’re wanting somebody to buy a course or, you know, purchase a jab, jab, punch, and that’s what just keep giving them value, giving them value. And then at the end, you, then you make your ask. But this sequence is not really about it. Yeah. You know, funneling people into a sale. It’s just getting them into your ecosystem and knowing what to expect from you.

[00:08:05] Jeff Sieh: So, one of the questions that I wanted to kind of go into after that is that, let’s say for Jeff Sieh, like, they come into Social Media News Live, I say, hey, go sign up for this, and so I tell them who I am, what the service I have, and I’m kind of like Lou, I have a lot of podcasting and all that stuff, and then do I say, hey, do I give them like a, I’ve seen other email people do this, like, here’s a button, and for you to be notified every time we have a new episode of Social Media News Live.

[00:08:34] Is that what you would do at the end of a sequence, say like for my, my brand or, I’m, because I think a lot of people I still think are confused about, okay, what’s my, what’s my call to action even at the end of my, my sequence? If I’m, if I’m a florist and I’m trying to build my email list because I want to push them my Valentine’s Day special or whatever, how do I do that at the end of the sequence?

[00:08:55] Paul Gowder: So for you, what I would say is in your series of emails, you’re going to talk about social media news live, and you’re going to explain what the show is, how often you go live, maybe even given a couple of examples of past guests. And in that email, I would say, Hey, if you want to know about, if you, you know, keep up to date with when we’re live, who the next guest is.

[00:09:13] Yeah, give them a call to give them a link and the cool thing is and what this is what I would recommend doing is With most email software, MailChimp, ConvertKit, whatever you’re using, you can then, if they click that link, put them in another sequence, that they then start getting those emails. So this is where you can start using, so like, for powwows.

[00:09:34] com, I have a series called What to Expect at Your First Powwow. And so in If you get into one of my sequences, maybe it’s just the aboutpowwows. com sequence when we’re just going through, here’s who we are, here’s, you know, kind of where we came from, somewhere in there, they’re going to get a message that says, Hey, are you new to Powwows?

[00:09:50] Do you, do you, have you never been before, or you’re curious about all this? If you, you know, if you want to know more, click here and that will put them in that other sequence and kind of give them that information. So you can use this also to kind of start funneling people out into different areas of your business.

[00:10:06] Jeff Sieh: Gotcha, gotcha. That makes total sense. We, and so we have, my friend Pat Mills is saying, love this first tip. So, she is, she is a social media, expert as well. So, and our friend Dustin Stout is waving hello. what, so, back to kind of the beginning thing. how important is it to Understand who your audience is when you’re crafting your first email campaign.

[00:10:32] Because a lot of people first start, and a lot of them are small businesses, or they’re marketers, or they’re social media managers and everybody wants to go, I’m every, I want, I want all the business. Like I’m not picky. Give it all to me. So how do you, how important is it to understand your audience and how do you drill down and figure that out?

[00:10:51] Paul Gowder: think it’s really important, but it doesn’t mean that you can’t start. If you build this first sequence of kind of the about you, ask some questions in that one, get some audio, you know, reader feedback and use that to kind of help you dig into your audience. If you’re still not sure of kind of where your niches are or what your different segments of your audience are, you can use this first email to ask questions and get and see what people do.

[00:11:16] And how they respond and which links they click on and where they go from there. And you can kind of build that. But, you know, sequences to me are really the key broadcast messages are great, but sequences are really, I think, where the value of email is. And the more you know about your audience and the more you learn about them, the more sequences you can build and it’s the more value that you’re going to be able to provide.

[00:11:39] when you are able to craft a sequence that really, Resonates with a particular group of your audience. They’re going to find that very valuable and they’re going to want to read those emails. They’re going to engage with it better. I think that’s huge, but you do have to get to know your audience first.

[00:11:55] Jeff Sieh: So I’m almost scared to ask, but how many sequences do you have set up for, your,

[00:12:00] Paul Gowder: I honestly don’t know. It’s, it’s a lot. and like even, you know, if you. See me talk before I always talk about giveaways. I love giveaways. And like you said, you just entered the giveaway every giveaway I have there’s even if it’s a two email sequence of one email sequence I always build a sequence for my giveaways Again, just so that people know what to expect from what they entered and then from there then, you know I can funnel them into other sequences too.

[00:12:26] But yeah, I have a lot

[00:12:29] Jeff Sieh: so. I knew you did, because I think you’ve told me the number before at one of your, one of your talks. what, how often do you go back and change up the sequence or refresh it or look at it? I mean, I’m sure you have ones that are like, these are my golden sequences because they always perform well. Do you, do you go back and tweak those like once a year, once every six months?

[00:12:52] How often are you going back and looking at what’s working and making adjustments?

[00:12:55] Paul Gowder: Yeah, I think that’s really important to set a task in your, in your task list to make sure that you are reviewing these and it depends on the sequence. So one of my best performing sequences, it’s just, Hey, here’s an article that we did. It might be three years old, and I think you might like it, and here’s why, and here’s a link to the article. That one we redo every December, and I go back and find what the best post, performing posts were the last year, and we redo that whole sequence. So it’s, it’s, usually it’s about 60 emails, you know, it’s even, it’s longer than a year, we send it out once a week.

[00:13:32] So that one we do, redo once a year. Some of the other ones I’ll redo, you know, once or twice a year. I’m actually going through, yesterday I went through two sequences and I kind of did their annual renew, annual, you know, kind of look at them. it, it depends on the sequence, you know, some of these can sit for a while, they’re okay.

[00:13:52] especially your general ones, you may want to just go back once a year or so, but some of these others that are, really specific, I, I’ve reviewed them probably once or twice, a year or more.

[00:14:02] Jeff Sieh: That’s good to know. I like your idea about setting a task to go back and go, Hey, by the way, you need to go look at this and double check it. And, you know, you know, like I know some people do like the Black Friday sales or whatever. And so that would be a good one to always check, you know, a couple of months before Christmas.

[00:14:18] Dustin says he has perfect timing for this. I’ve been meaning to get my email sequencing for Magi. You could ask Magi to actually help you do that, and that’s what I have been doing. I’ve been starting to do, some using, some of those things to help me figure out my audience and also to, write some things as an email sequence.

[00:14:34] So it doesn’t ask the audio. There’s some connection issue. I’m not sure what’s going on. it’s, it’s probably on, we’ll just, we’ll just see what’s going on. And so, I don’t think it’s Jungle Book. I think it’s the Disney 100, Gary. So, but I’m glad. Yeah, that’s very cool.

[00:14:52] Paul Gowder: And I love Robinhood, so that’s

[00:14:54] Jeff Sieh: yeah, that’s, yeah, my daughter actually has that as her ringtone.

[00:14:58] the, the rooster song. What? I’m thinking Disney stuff. The fun thing is, I want to talk about is the tools that work. And I know as you grow, the tools grow with you, because a lot of times you have, you know, you have to pay for X amount of subscribers, and as your list goes up, it’s important to cull your list, because you want to be paying for people who are actually reading your emails.

[00:15:23] But let’s take it from this beginning section, like starting email marketing. What are some tools that you would recommend for, for people who are just starting out or wanting to, like, take their email to the next level?

[00:15:36] Paul Gowder: A lot of people, and I started with MailChimp. I think that’s a really easy platform for most people to get into. I’m now on ConvertKit, and it’s, if you’re, if you’re planning on building sequences and doing that kind of work, it might be a better place to start, even though it probably has a little bit higher price point.

[00:15:52] MailChimp is really user friendly and, and kind of is easy to get into. So those are probably the two places I would start is, is find, you know, a good. email provider. there’s some other ones out there that people are raving about. Flowdesk, I know is getting a lot of attention. but the MailChimp and ConvertKit are probably the two that I have the most experience with.

[00:16:12] I like those. and then another one, if you are running it. I know a lot of us out there have Facebook groups. One of the first tools I would get if you’re, if you have a Facebook group and you’re planning on using a Facebook group is, a tool called, group leads. And that allows you to, when you ask questions of your Facebook group, when for membership, you know, you can have the three questions that people have to answer to join your group.

[00:16:38] One of those questions can be what’s your email. And then group leads will actually take those and pull them right into your email platform. So those, those are two that I would start with. Yes,

[00:16:51] Jeff Sieh: interesting that you said that because being that you have a Facebook group that has over a million, followers, that can be really important because when you have a group that size, that’s really scary because Facebook giveth and Facebook can taketh away and so having that in place from the beginning It’s kind of like your backup plan.

[00:17:08] Wouldn’t you say that, Paul?

[00:17:10] Paul Gowder: for sure. These algorithms, you know, you can’t depend on Google’s SEO either. I mean, I’ve been hit with this helpful content update. Probably lots of you out there have been hit with it too. You never know whether it’s Facebook, Google, any of these, what their algorithms are going to do. And you go up and down.

[00:17:27] So that’s why whatever you’re doing, put, put an email subscribe box on everything and collect emails from as many different places you can. That’s my backup plan is keeping those emails.

[00:17:38] Jeff Sieh: So one of the things, I wanted to talk about when we talk about tools, because I am a big fan of what you said before, you know, MailChimp and ConvertKit. I’m actually using ConvertKit as well. I switched over them to many, many years ago. And both of those have free platforms. Like, you can, like, if you’re getting started, you can set up and not have to pay anything up to, like, I think it’s usually a thousand subscribers.

[00:17:59] I think it’s for ConvertKit, and maybe the same thing for Mailchimp. So, start out, and then you can scale as you grow, and not be really out a lot of money, but you can still have all the tools that these really powerful platforms use, and hopefully, as you grow, you can start affording more of these tools.

[00:18:15] So, both of those are, are really good, so I just wanted to point that out to people. are there any, like, common misperceptions that you can think about, about email marketing that new marketers should be kind of aware of, from people who are just starting?

[00:18:29] Paul Gowder: And let me go back. I do remember one other tool I want to mention. ConvertBox is really, is the other tool that I use all the time. That’s what will let you put, a pop up subscribe box or embed it in your content. It will help you place email subscribe boxes all over your website. But a common misconception, I think, and I did this for a long time, and I think that’s When you’re sending out your broadcast messages, so many people are using their broadcast messages as, I mean, really, it’s people just shouting out, you’re just yelling at your audience.

[00:19:01] And I think it is so important to use your, your sequences, your broadcast, whatever. I think it is really important to think of email. As part of your community, even though it’s a, you know, kind of you talking to them, mainly, it, they are still part of your community, and you’ve got to treat your email subscribers like they are part of your community, and by doing that, I don’t mean just I tell people this all the time.

[00:19:25] My emails used to look like a Sunday sales paper. It used to be just flashy, flashy, you know, graphics and all this stuff. And, and I felt like I really, I was just shouting at people. And when I changed over and made it text based and I talked directly to them, I put, I put my name in the emails, you know, this is written by me and I.

[00:19:42] I use first person, you know, and I talk directly to them. I think that’s a common misconception is making your emails sound like they’re coming from the brand or some third party. Your email is you talking to your audience and you use it that way.

[00:19:55] Jeff Sieh: That is great. That is great stuff. And so, by the way, make sure you guys go to paul goer.com, sign up for his stuff so you can see what he’s talking about with his sequences. ’cause he does do a really good job. One of the things that I wanted to ask, what if you have been, one of those people who just shout out, it’s like, a blast.

[00:20:12] Like you’ve done been doing it that way for years and you wanna start making sequences. Is there a way to kind of reinvent the wheel? I mean. If you already have a kind of a bulk amount of people, let’s say you’ve, you’ve reached that limit of a thousand subscribers on ConvertKit, but you want to move those from a broadcast kind of strategy to a sequence strategy.

[00:20:33] Is there a way you can do that easily? How would you do that if you’ve been doing it wrong this entire time? I’m asking for a friend.

[00:20:39] Paul Gowder: Oh, sure.

[00:20:40] Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

[00:20:41] Paul Gowder: ConvertKit has tools where you can, you can take who you already have in your email list and move them around into sequences. But the other thing is in your next broadcast message, say, say we’re going to go back to the example where, You want to ask people if they want to be updated each week about the show.

[00:20:57] Send that in a broadcast message in ConvertKit. The term is called link trigger. And so if somebody clicked on that, then you could, then it would automatically put them in a sequence to get the emails every week that you’re going to send out about your, your live show. So that just use your broadcast and ask people, Hey, you want to, do you want more information about X?

[00:21:16] And then you can use the automated tools in the, in whatever email platform you’re using to put them in those sequences.

[00:21:22] Jeff Sieh: gotcha. That’s, see, this is why I love the show. It’s free consulting, folks. Have your own show and ask your consulting questions. so, what is a strategy that had worked well for you when you began growing your email list at Powwows. com? Was there something that you went, okay, this makes sense, I’m going to do more of it, and you have just kind of refined it over the years?

[00:21:41] Mm

[00:21:42] Paul Gowder: A couple of things. One is asking for email, in, in every place you can. I, I, several months ago, I audited, several folks websites and what I found every time I looked at a, you know, an article on somebody’s website, they’d put all this time into crafting this great blog post and made it so pretty and had the perfect SEO structure and nowhere on that page did they ask for an email.

[00:22:08] So that’s really important is, is do that. But then, Giveaways have been a huge part of Powwows. com’s email growth. the way we do them at Powwows. com by, you know, Making giveaways that my readers really love and they share it with their friends. We offer prizes that my readers would want, not necessarily the general public.

[00:22:30] And that has really helped grow it a lot. but also making, another really important one is using landing pages. And so by landing page, I mean making a page on your website that has nothing on it except a subscribe box. You know, you have a little bit of text to say what the landing page is about and a simple subscribe box.

[00:22:51] And so, for example, if I’m on a, if I’m on a live show, or podcast or something, and I want to tell people they can find out about a powwow near them, I tell them, hey, just go to powwows. com Powwows near me. And that takes them to a landing page. And if they subscribe there, they’re going to get the Powwow calendar sent to them.

[00:23:09] You can make these simple landing pages and then make, easy URLs to be able to tell people, but it’s a great way. Well, however you get the traffic to those landing pages is it’s one simple call to action and you get them in that sequence that you need them to be.

[00:23:26] Jeff Sieh: That is a great, that’s a great, idea. So, I guess I’m going to have to start doing all this stuff. And Dustin was saying, you know, he goes, that’s one of the advantages of being a scrappy startup, being able to write emails to your customers as yourself. And Gary says, Arnand Senwell signs off his, CBInsights emails with I love you.

[00:23:44] He says it’s a super personal approach. A great newsletter, by the way. And our friend Lou Mangiello, like, he always talks, he always does it in his podcast and also his, you know, his emails, I believe, is like, hey friend. Like, he doesn’t make it friends. He makes it so it’s really talking to just one person, the person who’s reading it or listening to it, which I think is really, really genius.

[00:24:05] So, that’s really cool. And, and, and on your giveaways, I wanted to point out, like, You’re not always just giving away like an iPad or something like that. A lot of times, you told me you had so many subscribers that were, you were just sending stickers out. Is that right?

[00:24:22] Paul Gowder: So, you know, I love this giveaway I just did. I need to sit down and kind of write it out and make an article and a blog post about it because I didn’t expect it to work as well as it did. So let me, I’ll tell you what I did. Over New Year’s, the New Year’s holiday, so it was New Year’s Eve, New Year’s Day, and the day after.

[00:24:38] So it was a three day giveaway. I used a piece of software called Viral Sweep, which allowed me to kind of build a giveaway where people could spin away a wheel and they would find out instantly if they won. It’s really cool because you can go in and add multiple prizes. You can, and then you can say, Hey, I have 10 of these prizes, 20 of these prizes, and it’ll take care of awarding all of those.

[00:25:01] So I did that and I did it with all stickers. That’s all we gave away was really just stickers. And I had, I think I gained. 800 new subscribers in those three days. And so it was a way for me to put it in my Facebook groups on my Facebook page and get people over to our email list that weren’t on there before and people were sharing it with their friends.

[00:25:25] So like here’s two of the stickers and I I use Sticker Mule for, well it’s not going to focus, focus, there it is, and so all the time Sticker Mule is running these specials where, you know, you can order 50 stickers for 20 bucks or whatever, and that’s so every time they run a special, I order a stack of stickers that I use in these giveaways, and then it’s just a first class stamp to mail the sticker out.

[00:25:48] Unfortunately, my daughter was home during this, so she took care of it, and I think, I think, You know, I think she sent out 500 packages. It was crazy. but it works so well. And it’s so, it was so easy to do. You know, anybody can go and order 50 stickers from, from Sticker Mule or wherever you want to get them and then just run a simple giveaway.

[00:26:08] Promote it on your Facebook page, get those folks over to your email list. It’s, you know, it’s so, it was so easy. And I never thought that, because usually we’re giving away, and I don’t have one next to me, but usually we’re giving away wool blankets that are expensive prizes. These are, you know, sometimes 400 blankets.

[00:26:25] And we get lots of entries and lots of people that enter this. I never thought that I would have this kind of response to just giving away stickers, but people loved it.

[00:26:34] Jeff Sieh: Yeah. That is, I think that is amazing. In fact, Amy Keyes goes, that’s a lot of stickers, but you think about the price. I mean, uh, the amount that you could do, like, I think an email is worth what 3 is what they’re saying now, something like that. And the stickers were not much with postage. I mean, that was a genius campaign and people wanted it.

[00:26:55] Paul Gowder: And when you set this up in the software, you can say how many prizes you want to give away. I’d been stocking up for a while. So I had hundreds to give away, but you can do it with just 50 stickers, right? You could do it with 20 stickers. It, it, you don’t have to go crazy like I did, but it’s really simple to do.

[00:27:12] The software is great. And, and the other cool part about this is so they spin the wheel and they can only spin the wheel once they give you their email address. And then if they want to spin it again, they have to complete other tasks. So that’s when you can have them go to a website, visit your services page, whatever it is.

[00:27:29] They have to complete these other tasks and then they get more spins.

[00:27:32] Jeff Sieh: That’s cool. That

[00:27:33] Paul Gowder: It was really cool.

[00:27:34] Jeff Sieh: So what is this? What’s this? Did you mention the software you’re

[00:27:37] Paul Gowder: Yeah, Viralsweep. com is what I use. There’s a couple others, but Viralsweep has this, it’s the, it’s called their Instant Win Game, and it’s really cool. People just love sitting there spinning that wheel.

[00:27:48] Jeff Sieh: So, by the way, if you want to see a viral Sweep campaign with kind of those tasks that you can do. You can also go to jeff c.com/pod fest meetup and see it’s right underneath the signup button. I just loaded it today on the website. So you go there. You can see how that kind of works and how if you add different ENT entries.

[00:28:05] E Camm did this for their holiday giveaway not very long ago as well, something like that. So it’s very, very effective. I actually use something like it when I way back in the time of dinosaurs. Where, I used, I started a podcast and I used it and I got a lot of people giving me ratings and reviews because that was one of the tasks that I gave them to do.

[00:28:23] So, check it out. I think it’s genius what Paul has done. He’s, he has been preaching giveaways as long as I’ve known him. So, he knows how to do it and how it’s effective and he’s kind of got the million page Facebook, you know, to show it, show that it works. So, take, that as you may. So let’s go into the next section we’re going to be talking about.

[00:28:44] email strategies and tools, because, Paul, you have grown one of the, like, this huge online community on Facebook, over a million followers. How can email marketers effectively use community building strategies to grow their lists? Because everything, you know, that was one of the reasons I was attracted to Momentum, and you were speaking there, and, you know, lose stuff.

[00:29:06] It’s all built around community, and what you said earlier about, Thinking of your email as a community too, so what are some strategies that you specifically attached with community building to your email list?

[00:29:19] Paul Gowder: You know, you mentioned earlier that people sometimes don’t know what their call to action is. I think in the beginning, your call to action should always be subscribe to my newsletter. And from there, you can, you can figure the rest out. And I think that’s, that’s what you’ve got to be doing, especially in the beginning, whether it’s, if you’re building a Facebook group, a podcast or a Facebook page, or just posting Instagram stories, you know, Julie, that you’ve had on the show before, she does amazing, content on her Facebook stories.

[00:29:45] And if you look at her stuff, a lot of the times her call to action in those stories are go get on my email list. And so that’s just, it just has to become part of what you do. It is. It is very difficult. So if like for podcasting, it was cool to hear you talk about, you know, that was one of the things you used in your early on to build your podcast.

[00:30:04] It’s very hard to get a listener to come to your website without some kind of, you know, incentive. So using a giveaway or something else to get them from a listener over to your website and then give you their email address. That’s, you know, that’s kind of where I would focus is figuring out how you get these folks off of these other platforms onto your email list.

[00:30:23] Don’t worry about, you know, converting them to. To customers are buying. Get them on your email list in the beginning, that’s the most important part. And then treat them like they’re part of community. Give them valuable information, talk directly to them, like I said before, and that’s where it’ll really start growing.

[00:30:39] Jeff Sieh: That’s great. And one of the things I did love about the viral sweep thing is that even to do anything, you had to give the email address. Like, that’s the, before you can go further and do anything, you have to do that. and so, that’s really good. And you also mentioned, if you’re driving people to like, let’s say you have a podcast episode on your blog where you have embedded the thing in the video or whatever, you also mentioned having pop ups, or like, things where they could download your free e book about whatever, or, so talk about that tool really quick.

[00:31:08] Paul Gowder: Yeah, so Convert Box is one of the tools I use for that, and it allows me to do things like, you know, I was talking about how I segment my list and maybe you’re a first time powwow visitor. So it allows me to put a. A pop up box, on pages that I feel like are probably the places that first time visitors are going to go, so I can kind of deliver them the right pop up, as opposed to, like, I also have some pages on how to trace your ancestry, you know, if you want to know more about your family background, so on those pages, I have another pop up that will put you in our sequence about tracing your family history, so it’s a really cool tool, and it, It works with WordPress.

[00:31:46] So if you’re on a WordPress, you know, it can, you can do it based on pages, categories, tags, all that kind of stuff. It’s really cool. The other thing I would say is as far as growing your list, another tool I recommend is Mediavine has a new tool called Grow. And it, I’ve talked about this before, but it has a, what they call Spotlight Subscribe.

[00:32:04] And it’s basically a. Newsletter subscribe box in the middle of your content. And as a reader scrolls past it, it highlights the box, fades the rest of it out and kind of like forces the reader to see that it’s an email subscribe box. And that’s a free program that anybody can use over at Grow with Mediavine.

[00:32:22] Jeff Sieh: That’s awesome. Yeah, you’ve told me about that and I have yet to put that on there now, reminding me to do that. So, so we talked about growing your followers, so that’s, I mean, that’s the first metric, like, you, you kind of look at is, okay, growing your followers. but Cassie brought up this great question, I mean, this comment, she goes, Yes, for my clients focusing on email, they convert 10 times on email versus social or, or something else.

[00:32:46] So, that is really cool that, you know, this is important, like, this stuff works. But how do we measure it? Other than just, like, okay, I got a new subscriber, which is the first metric that I’m sure everybody’s looking at. What other metrics should we be tracking and looking at when we are starting to run these campaigns and these drip campaigns to make sure what we’re doing is worth the time that we’re putting into it?

[00:33:07] Paul Gowder: If you’re new to email marketing, I think the first metric should be how many people are replying. And if you are building a sequence, we go back to this welcome sequence I talked about. If you’re building that correctly and you’re engaging with them and asking them questions and wanting feedback from them.

[00:33:23] If people are replying to that and you’re able to start conversations with individuals, then you know it’s working. If you’re, if you. You know, you’ve got 50 people that subscribe to your list and they’ve all gone through your welcome sequence and you, it’s crickets? We might want to go back and rewrite some things, right?

[00:33:40] You got to know that they’re, that’s the first thing is, are they replying? And then, then once you have enough people coming through, we want to look at open rates. We want to look at click through rates. You want to make sure that your open rate is staying pretty high, that people are actually reading your emails.

[00:33:55] If your open rate starts dropping, then it might be ending up in spam folders and there’s things we can do there. But yeah, the first thing is, are people actually replying to you?

[00:34:04] Jeff Sieh: Mm. That’s a great point. So, on that note of replying to you, on each of your emails in that sequence, do you have, like, a question that you’re asking to get them to reply? Is that how you’re structuring those sequences? Because a lot of people will just throw stuff out and say, well, no one’s replying to me, but they never asked a question or asked for a response.

[00:34:22] Paul Gowder: I, like the what to expect at your first Powerwall, the first email I send, it ends with a, Hey, what are you most excited about? Are you looking forward to seeing the dancing, the food, the crafts? What is it? What are you excited about? And I get, you know, a dozen emails a week or so from people replying to that.

[00:34:38] And so much fun. Cause then I can, then I can send them more information. We can talk more. and then, you know, you really have an engaged reader. Yes, I am. I am asking them questions directly. I’m not, you know, I’m hoping they’re going to read it and reply to me because they liked it. I’m asking them direct questions.

[00:34:54] Jeff Sieh: That’s great. So do you ever get overwhelmed with responses? I figure like with a, a million thing and like, do you have canned responses that you send people or do you like, like answer everyone like personally?

[00:35:10] Paul Gowder: I do use some automated tools. I, I’m on Mac, so I use a little tool called text expander. It lets me have some canned responses, but usually it’s the basis. It’s the base of the response, right? So then I can go and customize it. So, one of the questions I get all the time, and this is not just from my emails I send out, but people just emailing me, I probably get, you know, 10 of these a day is, hey.

[00:35:34] I’m from New Jersey. Is there a powwow near me? And so I have a canned response that will help them, but then I can kind of customize it and say, by the way, in your state, you may want to go look at the powwows here, here, and here, that kind of thing. Right. But I have a base and yeah, they can be overwhelming, especially, you know, if, if you get.

[00:35:50] If you have a giveaway or something that really takes off, you can get overwhelmed. So use, use canned responses as your base. Just like, you know, AI, it is, you’re not using it to replace everything you’re doing. You’re still going to, it’s just a tool. You’re going to put your voice in with it.

[00:36:05] Jeff Sieh: Very, very cool. So, you’ve mentioned a couple of, different campaigns and examples, but do you have one, like, a particular, a particularly successful email campaign that you’ve run and, like, are really proud of? And can you tell us, like, kind of, you know, what made that so effective?

[00:36:21] Paul Gowder: Yeah. So I’ll go back to the first one. That’s easy. Anybody, if you’ve been writing articles or writing, doing a podcast for more than, you know, five weeks, then do some kind of throwback Thursday. Find, you know, create a sequence that will expose all your past content. I think that’s a really easy one. I love, every Friday morning checking my Mediavine stats to see, you know, our ad revenue and every Friday we see a little bump from our Thursday revenue because that email went out.

[00:36:50] That’s an easy one and that one’s really good to create. Another one that I’m proud of, we do this every year, is in November with Native American Heritage Month. I created an email series and a whole challenge giveaway around it called Explore Native. And in that sequence, I’m challenging my readers to dig a little deeper into Native culture, whether it’s reading something on powwows.

[00:37:12] com or going and watching a YouTube video, going to some other website. I send them all over the place in that series of emails. And this year, I think the email series was, I think it was 60 emails. So we ran it from the middle of October to the middle of December. that one takes a lot of work and I, I, I work on that for weeks leading up to it.

[00:37:33] but that one I’m so proud of because the people who go through that, I get. I get responses from them all the time about, Oh my gosh, it’s so great. Thank you for sending us this. And, and in that sequence, you know, going back to, do I ask them questions in that sequence? I’ll, I’ll have a email maybe, you know, 15 days in that says, Hey, today, I’m not really going to challenge you to do anything, but.

[00:37:54] I just want you to tell me, what have you learned so far? What’s been your favorite thing you’ve read? And it’s really, those are really cool because, you know, it kind of takes a break. They don’t have to do something that day. And again, you get that feedback from them. and it’s, people are still going through that sequence, even though their contest is over, our challenge is over.

[00:38:10] And so I’m still getting emails every day about, Hey, here’s what I learned. And so it’s really cool to see that.

[00:38:15] Jeff Sieh: That’s awesome. That’s awesome. By the way, something else that’s really awesome is our pals over at Ecamm and I don’t know why my, my little third is not there anyway. Socialmedianewslive. com. com. com. com, Ecamm, they’re what make this show possible and, they’re also going to be with us at our Podfest meet up.

[00:38:32] So, make sure you go check them out. socialmedianewslive. com. com. com, Ecamm, but come meet them in real life at Hollywood Studios. Doc Rock is Hoot, and Katie is amazing as always, so if you guys want to check out, Paul and I and pick our brains for a little bit as we, eat a Dole Whip or whatever we decide to have there at Disney, and we’re gonna, I think we’re gonna eat lunch at Docking Base 7, which is right in the middle of Galaxy’s Edge.

[00:38:56] You can find out more about that at jeffsieh. com forward slash podfest meetup. All right, so let’s go on to our next little section here. that we’ll be talking about is, the pitfalls and best practices. We’ve kind of touched on this a little bit, but I kind of wanted to go into what are some of the biggest pitfalls that you’ve encountered and maybe some mistakes that you’ve done, Paul, and what we can do not to make those same mistakes.

[00:39:24] Paul Gowder: Yeah. I’ve talked about a couple of them and, you know, sending out these shouting emails, but another question I get asked all the time. As far as best practices is how often should I send an email? And I think, and here I’m talking about really broadcast messages, the ones that you’re not in a sequence that you’re sending out to your entire list for those.

[00:39:45] And you can easily overwhelm your audience, but I think you can send out, you can send multiples a week as long as you’re adding value. When you start sending out emails, That aren’t valuable your readers are going to let you know whether it’s unsubscribes your open rate drops or in my case I made a mistake last weekend.

[00:40:05] I scheduled three emails on the same day Not I just didn’t I wrote them at three different days and I didn’t realize I scheduled them all on the same day I heard about it, right? They let me know. Um, they, they were, there was a lot of people not happy. And then one, I messed up and had to send a correction and it was, it was a bad day.

[00:40:24] but so that’s one of the things is you can, you can send multiples a week if you have value. I, I’ve kind of created a schedule. So during normal times, you know, we have an email that goes out on Tuesdays. We have the throwback Thursday and then Friday I reserve for kind of special announcements, whether it’s a, when we were putting a t shirt on sale or like, today we’re going to be live streaming from a powwow in California.

[00:40:51] So today we’ll be sending out a broadcast message about that and how you can watch it. So that’s best practices. I think, you know, Figure out what you’re, where you add value and send more than one a week. Don’t, don’t think you can only send one a week. All right. You can send more. As long as your people are enjoying it and you’re reading it, just watch, watch your open rates, listen to them, and then go from there.

[00:41:14] other pitfalls, you know, it’s. is be careful what you’re sending in these emails, you know, make sure that people are going to read it. And this is where I think it’s so important that you do engage them as, as they’re part of your community and you’re talking to them. You don’t want to, if your open rates start dropping, Google, Gmail and other places are going to know that you’re open rates and people aren’t opening the email and you’re going to start ending up in the spam folder or in Gmail, the promotions tab.

[00:41:44] You got to really make sure that your audience is reading your emails, hopefully clicking on something. So that you keep that engagement rate up.

[00:41:52] Jeff Sieh: So on, you know, you’re talking about like maintaining authenticity. And having this personal touch, which you do with your emails, and your sequences. One of the things, and you and I kind of talked about this a little bit the other day, was I’ve seen, I’ve been seeing a lot of people, especially on Instagram, but also like on Facebook, they’ll say like, hey, you know, type in code, you know, free giveaway in the chat, and that enters them into their email list, and it’s kind of this automated sequence, which like for a live show would be a lot of, you know, I’ve looked at maybe doing that.

[00:42:23] But then you kind of lose maybe some of that. Authenticity and maybe that personal chat, touch because they’re going to a chat. What are your thoughts about using those kind of things to automate building your email list?

[00:42:35] Paul Gowder: There’s some cool tools that will let you do that kind of thing. And I think it’s, again, I think it’s so important to find ways to take your audience from your, whether it’s Instagram lives, or just your Facebook posts and getting them off of these platforms onto your email list is exactly what Facebook and, you know, all these other they don’t want you doing right.

[00:42:53] But you got to find ways to do that. Those, those automated tools are great, but here’s where I would say. Make sure that you don’t mess it up is when you get somebody type in a comment that will then put them on their email list, have a sequence ready so that they get an email from you instantly that is going to be in your voice and you’re, you know, being yourself and being personable.

[00:43:15] you don’t want them to just be stuck in a Facebook Messenger, you know, automated bot. I don’t, those were really cool when they first came out and I think people saw a lot of success, but now people want that. They don’t want. To feel like they’re just stuck in an AI loop or talking to AI. So use that tool, get them in your sequence, and then send them those emails that you’ve written.

[00:43:36] That are, that are you.

[00:43:38] Jeff Sieh: I think that’s a great, because I think it’s really handy to say, hey, you know, you know, type in Descript 101 to be, get a, a free email sequence about my Descript course, right? And it does that, but then those emails that come out are in my voice and not just, I’ve seen like there’s some other podcasters who use it for like a guide or something like, get my free guide.

[00:43:58] Or my, you know, here are my top, you know, gifts for, for guys on Amazon for the holidays or something like that. I think getting that friction thing done really quickly is really cool, but then you’ve got to make it so it’s one, technically legal and you don’t break, you mentioned some, you got to be careful about some of those bots because Facebook doesn’t like certain things and they can change the rules on you and all that kind of stuff.

[00:44:20] Paul Gowder: Yeah. And I, I had, I tried mini chat a couple of years ago and, I’m still not sure what we did wrong, but we got, you know, banned from using Facebook Messenger for a couple of days. because the mini chat bot was sending, I think probably it was just because we sent so many messages with it. Because of the size of the audience. But you have to be really careful with these automated tools. And there’s some rules coming out. Google is going to start enforcing some things for email marketers this year. So, you got to make sure you follow these even now Google’s new rules about, you know, being authenticated, and having some things set up in your DNS that they know you are a legitimate sender.

[00:45:00] be real careful. You don’t want to end up in the spam folder or the promotions tab and just lose your audience that way.

[00:45:06] Jeff Sieh: That’s a great point that we didn’t even get into the different sections of Gmail, which is interesting. And Rich says here, he goes, I hate the comment to win CDAs. It seems like a ton of scammers troll those, and DM the heck out of responders. So, that is a great point as well. And I wanted to know what your thoughts on this.

[00:45:24] Gary said, If you’re big into email for your business, make sure that your email server has DMARC turned on, prevents hackers from hijacking your server, and only a fraction of business owners enable DMARC, leaving them very vulnerable to spammers. Is that if you have your own email server? Is that what he’s talking about?

[00:45:39] Paul Gowder: Yeah, that, that’s what kind of what I was alluding to. There’s the DMARC and some other things that you, these are now going to be requirements, whether you’re on ConvertKit or MailChimp. if you have your, so my emails are sent from powwows. com, even though there’s being sent through ConvertKit. So with that, having my own domain, sending the emails, Google and others are going to require you to have a DMARC turned on, as well as some other things in your DNS to prove who you are.

[00:46:06] there, there’s some other things that like verified senders so that, These platforms know that here are the services that can send on your behalf. So like if you’re using ConvertKit, Gmail wants to know, okay, if ConvertKit sends 100, 000 emails from powwows. com, it’s legitimate. And so you have to put that in your DNS now.

[00:46:26] Jeff Sieh: Hmm. Interesting. So I’m sure ConvertKit will have a walkthrough with this and start like moving people in because this is their business.

[00:46:34] Paul Gowder: Yes. And then They’ve started talking to some folks about it. it’s already in their tool. They it’s been in there for a long time, but it’s kind of complicated right now. So, yeah, they’re going to be sending out some emails here, I think shortly because the rules are coming quickly.

[00:46:51] Jeff Sieh: Okay. Very, very cool. Yeah, because that’s something that you don’t want to get on the wrong side of. Gary says it enables hackers to launch ransomware attacks from your email, ruins business reputations. And so Gary says he has a podcast episode about it on Small Business Matters. Gary, drop that in to the comments and I’ll make sure to point to that in the show notes.

[00:47:12] And when we put it out on the website, that would be a great resource for people to go check out. And so, kind of as we wrap up this, the, the, kind of the end of our time, once again, I, this stuff flies by because it’s, I think it’s fascinating and you do such a great job explaining it, Paul. But, what do you think of some, like, where email is heading?

[00:47:33] Like, first of all, before we get to that one, I want to talk about, like, the practices of culling your list. Like, we kind of touched on it a little bit. Like, how often do you need to do that when you’re first starting out? Because I know a lot of people are like, I’ve got, you know, 5, 000 subscribers. If I culled my list, I’ll only have two.

[00:47:50] Like, and I only have 2, 000 then. So, what do you tell people who are scared to go through and, like, You know, take away the people who are not opening their emails.

[00:48:00] Paul Gowder: So again, I, I have a scheduled task and I prune my list quarterly. I live by to do list. So, you know, I just make sure I remember it. so I do it quarterly and I, in ConvertKit, there’s a, a tag that is automatically created, that it’s called cold subscribers. And so it’s based on if somebody hasn’t opened or clicked on one of your messages in three months.

[00:48:23] So it is really scary. When I first started doing this, I, Didn’t like it and I, you know, I let my email subscribers run way up. Here’s a couple things to keep in mind. One, if they haven’t opened your email in a while, they’re not your people. They, you’re no longer, you know, resonating with them. They’re not reading it.

[00:48:42] It’s okay. You only want people on your email list that are your people and are engaged in your content. So it’s okay to remove them. last time I culled my list, I unsubscribed 15, 000 people.

[00:48:55] Jeff Sieh: Oh, that

[00:48:57] Paul Gowder: is scary. It is scary to lose that many people. But the other part is yes, these all of these platforms charge you by how many subscribers you have.

[00:49:05] So it’s going to keep your your cost down, but it’s also going to boost your open rates because you don’t have another 15, 000 people that aren’t opening anything. so you you want to do that, you know, you want to really prune it. So in the way I do it is and ConvertKit has some automation that helps with this is so I send out an email that says, Hey, I noticed you haven’t opened my email in a few months.

[00:49:26] It’s okay. I miss seeing you. I hope you’ll come back. If you want to stay on the list, click here and then the automation will make sure that they’re taken off the cold subscribers list, but if not, it’s okay. And thanks for being a part of the powwows. com community. And then, so if they don’t click on that link within a certain time, they’re unsubscribed.

[00:49:45] Jeff Sieh: is scary for a small potatoes. 15, 000. Wow. so, okay. So the last question, where do you see email marketing heading, like with the, all this AI stuff that’s coming out? Dustin kind of talked about it a little bit. are there any other things you’re seeing like it’s going to happen in 2024? Other, you know, Gary mentioned the DMARC stuff that’s coming.

[00:50:04] Is there anything else that you see on the horizon for email marketing and marketers?

[00:50:09] Paul Gowder: I see more and more people starting to talk about email. I think with all these algorithm changes and organic reach down on Google and Facebook, I think people are finally coming back to email and I think it’s, there’s going to be a lot of focus and attention on email. So I, I, what I see the trend is, is that more people are going to be sending emails.

[00:50:29] So it’s even more important that you are writing emails that You don’t want to be lost, not just in the spam folder, but you don’t want to be lost in the inbox. You want people to look forward to your email. So I think it’s super important. And then, you know, with, I think there’s gonna be so many more emails being sent out this year because everybody’s kind of going back to this, going back to the basics of email.

[00:50:53] So if you’re going to, if you’re going to create like a broadcast message, you know, I went back to like, I send something on Tuesday, I send something on Thursday. Start being really consistent with that so that people know when to look forward to it. Angie Robinson, I know that she sends her email at the same time every week.

[00:51:10] I, you know, I look forward to her message. I know when it’s going to be there in my inbox. So once you can have that kind of established, the same thing as you know, people know that Social Media News Live is on Fridays, you know,

[00:51:21] Jeff Sieh: All right, yep.

[00:51:22] Paul Gowder: They look forward to it, right? So, be consistent with it and then make sure you’re engaging with them because it’s going to be, the competition in the inbox is going to be increasing this year, I think.

[00:51:35] Jeff Sieh: Yes, it’s, it seems like it’s increasing everywhere, but if you’re doing it right, and you’re doing some of these best practices that Paul has been mentioning, this is a great way to start out your 2024. We’ve got some great comments. Gary says this, he says, with Google eliminating third party cookies, owning your own list is shifting into primary focus, which I believe is true as well, Gary.

[00:51:56] And then Dustin goes, isn’t it funny? How many email marketing is dead articles have been, have been, and yet it all lasts out all the other channels, which is very, very true. So if you’re not doing it, it’s what’s, what’s that saying that they’re, they, people say like the best time to plant a tree is like, you know, a year ago, but the second best time is today.

[00:52:15] So it’s that kind of a thing. So like, if you haven’t done it, it’s okay. Everybody starts at zero. but this is a great. It’s a great day to start. Rewind this, listen to some of the other stuff that Paul has. If you’re going to be in Florida on the 24th, come and ask Paul and me your questions, because we’re going to have a meetup at jeffsieh.

[00:52:33] com forward slash podcast meetup in Hollywood Studios, meeting the incredible folks over at Ecamm and Mediavine is sponsoring as well. come hang out with us. It’s just going to be such a fun day. What else could be other than, you know, hanging out at Star Wars, you know, Galaxy’s Edge with your friends, talking shop, eating food, oh my gosh, and write it off for a business expense?

[00:52:53] Come on! You can’t do better than that. So, come meet us at the meetup at jeffsieh. meetup. And thanks to our sponsors Ecamm. You can find out more about them at socialmedianewslive. com forward slash Ecamm. They are an amazing group of folks over there and they make this show. possible. Gary says, very informative, informative chat today, guys.

[00:53:13] Thank you, Gary, for your great questions and comments, for everybody stopping on. But before we go, I want people to find out more about Paul Gowder, the amazing Paul Gowder. Where can people find out more about you and what you’re doing, Paul?

[00:53:24] Paul Gowder: Yeah, please come on over to paulgatter. com. I’ve already got one course on giveaways. I love Check that out. I’ve got some other courses coming in the next couple of months on some email practices. We’re going to talking about kind of how to build your first sequences, but also come over and let’s talk more.

[00:53:39] You know, Gary asked some great questions about DMARC and the loss of cookies. There are some things you can do right now. There’s some tools out there that I can help you with. The loss of cookies is going to be big to anybody who is running ads on their website. It’s going to be very important that you have these tools ready and have your emails set up in the right way.

[00:53:58] So I’d love to help you out. And I also have a program for anybody who’s looking to kind of jumpstart their email list. I’d love to help you out. It’s all over there at paulgatter. com.

[00:54:08] Jeff Sieh: And he is amazing. He’s helped out a lot of people. A lot of people are in the audience as well. Amy, he says, awesome episode. Thank you both. Thank you, Amy, for being here today. Thank you, Gary, for being here. Thank you, Dustin, discord coach. she says she is ready to take some action. Which is awesome. I think this has been a kind of a, a great, not wake up call, but encouraging episode for us all to like, okay, let’s get personal about our email.

[00:54:33] Let’s start doing this the right way. And I mean, Paul’s got the growth to prove it, that it works. So, thank you, Paul, for being here. Thank you guys for showing up and we will see you guys all next week. Bye everybody.

[00:54:46] Paul Gowder: Thanks.

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