SHOW TRANSCRIPT

This transcript is automatically generated by Descript.  Any errors or omissions are unintentional.

Jeff Sieh: [00:00:00] Hello folks. Welcome to Social Media News Live. I’m Jeff c and you’re not.

Conor Brown: And I’m Connor Brown, and this is the show that keeps you up to date on what’s happening in the world of social media and more.

Jeff Sieh: You ever catch yourself asking how AI can actually help a small business grow? Maybe you’re wondering what separates brands that thrive from those that fade away, or maybe you’re ready to weave artificial intelligence into your daily workflow, but don’t know where to begin. If any of that feels familiar, you are in the right place.

’cause today we’re excited to sit down with Phil Palin, who is a branding strategist, keynote speaker, and author of AI for Small Business who transformed his fascination with design and tech into a career guiding companies around the globe. So Phil is here to unpack his favorite real world AI tactics, share stories from the front lines and dish out practical tips that you can apply before this episode ends.

Don’t leave, but, uh, stay here and, and you can do it right after. So sit back, clear your schedule, clear your mind, and let’s get ready for this [00:01:00] week’s episode of Social Media News Live. Phil, how are you doing today?

Phil Pallen: I am excellent. I mean, I can’t think of a better way to spend my Friday. It’s a Friday At the time that we’re recording this live, I have looked forward to this. I, uh, you and I met by chance, um, met up by chance in the airport

Jeff Sieh: Yeah, that’s right. That’s right.

Phil Pallen: that was, so we sat so like awkwardly, but so wonderfully side

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: side in the airport lounge catching up.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

Phil Pallen: had said to me when we met for the first time in person at creator camp, oh my gosh, Phil, I, I know you. And I was like, Jeff, literally I’ve been following you for years, since Pinterest

Jeff Sieh: Oh yeah. Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: like, I mean, for years. So I’m just so happy that we’re connected. And also Connor, we got to meet at e

Conor Brown: Yeah,

Phil Pallen: uh, Ecamm Creator Camp.

So I’m, I’m really, I’ve been looking forward to this for a long time. I.

Jeff Sieh: This is awesome, man.

Conor Brown: We’ve been looking forward to it as well. Like Phil said, I got to see Phil speak at Creator [00:02:00] camp and meet him. He’s awesome. We’re so excited he’s here. But if you don’t know who Phil is, you should. Phil is a leading brand and AI strategist who has helped small businesses around the world achieve meaningful growth. He’s a trusted collaborator of Adobe, a member of the Content Authenticity Initiative, and has delivered keynote speeches on five different continents. That’s almost all of them. Phil is the author of AI for Small Business and the creator of Brand Masters, a private membership community launching soon.

Again, welcome to the show, Phil.

Jeff Sieh: And,

Phil Pallen: so happy to be here.

Jeff Sieh: and I just wanna do a shout out because really I guess I get to meet Phil for the first time because of our friends over at Ecamm. They’re the ones who sponsored the show. You can always find out more about them. Grab you going to Ecamm dot com slash jeff and you can say. 15% off your first purchase by using the code, Jeff.

15. But, uh, once again, amazing community over there. They connect people, they just don’t sell software. They actually actually connect people and really do a good job with their community. So [00:03:00] go and check them out, appreciate them for sponsoring the show. We’re gonna dive right into it because Phil, you, you literally, like I said, wrote the book on AI for small business, and I think it’s been said, you’ve researched AI a hundred times, more than many so-called experts.

So we have a lot to learn from you. So let’s start with some practical AI tips for small businesses, because really your book is packed with ways to streamline everything from like customer service to marketing and then copywriting, but. Many small businesses are overwhelmed by ai and it’s, you often suggest like starting small, like picking one AI tool to tackle your business, your biggest pain point.

So can you give us an example of how a business might do that? Like what’s a first quick win with ai? Who’s for someone who’s really new to it?

Phil Pallen: Oh my gosh, yes. And what I love about this space right now is, um, we are all learning. Yes, I may have written a book about this, but the truth is [00:04:00] guys and gals and everyone else out there, um, I’m learning just like you. And so where I would get up a on stage and speak with absolute confidence about a topic that I’ve been. You know that I built a business around personal branding, social media, strategy marketing. That’s been 15 years. When we think about ai, this has really only been generally accessible to us for about two to three,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: years. Um, I remember getting an email from a brand called synthesia. It was three or four years ago.

They said, Phil, we’d like your YouTube videos. We’re just starting to create content on YouTube. We’d like you to try our custom avatar. Uh, it might be a lot of fun to create a Phil avatar. And I said, how do I know you’re not gonna eat? Do that and then use it for government propaganda in Venezuela. And they said, we’re not gonna do that.

We’re a part of this organization called the Content Authenticity Initiative. Actually owned, uh, created by Adobe. Um, wasn’t doing any, anything with Adobe back then, but I said, yes, I’ll work with you. I’d love to try this technology. I’ve [00:05:00] always been interested in technology. 2011, when I started my business, social media was all the,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: And I’ve always just been interested in this, but I’ve always been interested in technology in terms of how it fits with being human from a branding standpoint. Pre ai, I’ve always said the best brands. Recreate the in-person experience.

Jeff Sieh: Mm.

Phil Pallen: it’s not about embellishing or exaggerating, but how do we take what we’re doing in real life and communicate that in three seconds or less online?

That’s always been what I’ve been interested in, but AI has come along, made a video for synesthesia. It went viral. That kind of paved the way for my side hustle, which was content creation that I started creating YouTube videos right before the pandemic, purely Jeff and Connor as a way to just like. Learn. I’m not really, believe it or not, not really a big writer. Um, do it, but I’m kind of slow. It took me a year, [00:06:00] uh, a little longer than a year to write the book and research. It was actually a bigger task than writing. But like, I like to do this. I like to Restream. I’ve been using e camm actually.

Funny you mentioned, for, for years. Not just as a tool to Restream, but as a tool to create content like YouTube videos. And I just, I like learning and we’re just in an era where there’s so much opportunity to learn. I don’t know everything about ai. Uh, my AI creator friends don’t necessarily know everything there is to know.

So we kind of pick our lane. Um, my lane is, uh, productivity for solopreneurs and for business owners and for small business owners, which, um, paved the way for me to kind of, you know, write this book and, and, and continue to create content. The publisher found me on YouTube. They watched one YouTube video about chat GPT, which was me just kind of trying to make sense of this tool in the earlier days.

Not necessarily being an [00:07:00] expert, but the publisher said, Phil, we like how you communicate what a lot of small business owners might find complicated and overwhelming. We like how you put it into simple terms. So, Jeff, to answer your question with a little bit of backstory before, that’s my area of focus.

How can small business owners stay laser focused on the things that matter? Areas of their business where they make high impact in their business that they enjoy doing, like live Streaming or creating content or For me, I love like creating my graphics for my YouTube videos.

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: that?

Probably I.

Jeff Sieh: Right. Yeah.

Phil Pallen: business, so I’m gonna keep doing it. Um, the opportunity exists where there are things on your to-do list that you don’t enjoy doing, things that don’t bring you joy. And so it’s super important. Step one, before we like pay for an AI tool, it’s super important that we become accountable for our working minutes.

So use a tool like [00:08:00] ever hour or use a tool like a manual to-do list or

Jeff Sieh: Right. Right.

Phil Pallen: And literally make note, anything that you spend more than five minutes on in the working week must be noted. It’s gonna take you longer to write that down, um, if you do it manually, but in, I use ever hour. So I literally click the play button, which overlays on Asana Monday, Trello Notion.

It works on all of those. And it means that I can attach time to my task so that the end of the week on Fridays, I will look back at my week and go, huh, with a highlighter, what brought me joy this week? Keep doing it. Where did I make high impact in my business? What are those tests that Phil Palin really needs to be doing? Keep doing those. more excitingly, what are the things I did this week where I didn’t make high impact or I did things that I didn’t really enjoy? Now we’re in a very exciting time where we can delegate and or [00:09:00] automate those things with the help of AI and with the help of AI tools. That’s kind of my nutshell and my stance and my suggestion on where to start.

Jeff Sieh: That is awesome be I love it because, um, I, I love that you take a, we’re we’re talking about AI tools and you use a highlighter, like, be, but that makes sense. Like, because we could do that in any sort of task manager we have. And I just think that that little piece of advice one, I’m gonna start doing that more because that makes a huge difference.

And I love that you said, I like editing, I’m gonna continue to do what I want ’cause so many times. All the gurus tell you, okay, you gotta delegate this and delegate this. But if stuff brings you joy, you know, keep doing it ’cause you’re good at it, kind of a thing. Love it. Love it, Phil.

Conor Brown: That’s awesome. I

Phil Pallen: And because you enjoy it, because you enjoy it. Like you guys, I’ve been reflecting on it this week funny for it to come up in conversation, but like I, maybe this is me maturing and, and, and getting old, but like I care less about growth scale, more money in [00:10:00] the bank account. Like I. Those things are important, and obviously I want to be productive and I want to be rewarded for hard

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: I care about spending my working minutes doing things.

I enjoy having clients. I like having projects that excite me and challenge me. And so if we, that all sounds great in theory, but like I’m a big fan of like small steps towards completing this marathon or completing this first mile of the

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: And so Jeff, to your point, let’s try to be accountable for where our working minutes go.

My approach isn’t, let’s get this done faster so we can work more. In fact, my approach is let’s work less but still get the amount, the same amount of work and impact done. But then it frees us up time to do the things we like doing that are probably not sitting in front of a computer.

Jeff Sieh: Great advice, great advice.

Conor Brown: true. So true. I think a big thing too is, you know, AI can help us do the things [00:11:00] we don’t want to do, right? That are tedious and those sorts of things, but it can also help our business be more efficient and, and be more

Phil Pallen: Yes,

Conor Brown: Phil, you talk a lot about customer service and

Phil Pallen: yes.

Conor Brown: of customers expect brands to offer 24 7 support.

That’s just not the

Phil Pallen: Yeah,

Conor Brown: When it’s a solo sort of thing or a

Phil Pallen: it’s not.

Conor Brown: but we’re attuned to that, right? I just placed a, an order for some shoes on on Amazon two days ago. Supposed to be here today. It hasn’t shipped. I’m losing my mind. I don’t know. Where are these shoes? Right? We are so conditioned to this now. can kind of help alleviate that stress and not have to have us constantly be checking our email, our messages 24 hours a day. And I think it kind of comes down to like chatbots and, and AI powered tools that can help you with customer service. What are your thoughts around that and, and where could someone start when it comes to building or, or getting a tool for an AI chat bot that can help their business?[00:12:00]

Phil Pallen: That’s a great question. I think AG agentic AI was probably the most commonly used term at Adobe Summit in Las Vegas about a month, a month and half and a half ago. Um, that’s across the board obviously. I, I, I work a lot with Adobe and typically talk a lot about their tools and platforms on my own social media.

Um, but age agentic AI is here to stay. Let’s understand quickly why, this is a form of, uh, or an access to AI that simulates natural language. It simulates conversation and that is. All we want and need, right? If we think about friction points or barriers in the past few years in marketing, it’s typically technology sitting in between you and me causing friction.

The most beautiful thing is when the three of us get to sit down and have coffee and listen to what we say, content we remember how each of us says it, personality. Those are the two elements of branding that I’ve been [00:13:00] teaching since I started this in 2011. And so now we’ve got the technology that really beautifully simulates human conversation.

So for example, when I’m opening Chad GPT, and I’ll say. need your help writing a YouTube script for my next video, which is a sponsored content partnership with Cookie Bot by user centric, a great platform to ensure that you’re compliant, uh, and, and respecting privacy laws and com uh, you know, compliance, so I’ll say my most commonly used, prompt back slash dta.

Don’t take action yet.

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: I use a tool called Text Plays to

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: text snippets and Google Chrome that’ll populate them really quickly. I type back slash dta, don’t take action yet. GBT will say, or Gemini or Clog, whatever you’re using. It’ll say, okay, great. I, this is the task. You know, feel free to provide more information before I take action.

[00:14:00] So then I’ll say, here’s the brief provided by the brand. This is what they’re looking for. Don’t take action yet. Okay, great. I see the brief and I’ll say, here is A PDF for a copy and paste of three recent YouTube videos that I’ve done to give you some idea of the formatting and the structure that I follow.

Learn from that. Don’t take action yet. Great. And then if I’m playing really dirty and I don’t know much about the brand, I’ll say here are transcripts of, uh, five other creators that have recently created on this topic. Don’t copy them. I, it is important to me that we have a unique stance

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: but learn from the way that they’re phrasing things and the features that they’re putting forward and the criticisms that they’re presenting. I bet there’s something in here for us to learn. Okay. Boom. So in like three steps, I’ve now collected a huge amount of data that my P brain could not have computed probably in an entire day, but I have now used ai. I’ve now used AI to essentially get the task done or at least get a draft that I can [00:15:00] finalize as the human in about 15 or 20 minutes. Um, I wanted to just give you, I love practical examples, which you’ll know if you’ve read more than two pages in the book. Like, I like examples. We don’t need to hear from anyone that’s like, Ooh, it’s, if you haven’t jumped on the AI train, you’re too late. I hate that. In fact, I know a lot of successful people that don’t use social media, and I know a lot of successful, successful people that haven’t figured out AI yet, and that’s perfectly fine.

But if we can start small and stay practical and lean into the opportunities where it can help us be more productive, work less. Those are the opportunities that are, that are exciting. So that’s an, that’s one example of how I’ll use AI today. And I think AG agentic ai to close that thought, it’s really just any opportunity for us to have a conversation that simulates human interaction.

And then of course leveraging on some, uh, database of, of, of [00:16:00] information and the speed at which it can do that is faster than humans can.

Jeff Sieh: Mm, such, so good. Sure.

Conor Brown: on that as well. So, uh, Gary was asking about DTA being, being a shortcut, and you said it was just a, a text place shortcut and just says, don’t take action. What? What is your, why do you do that? Like, instead of just doing one big dump with every single PDF and all the, the information you have about a brand, why do you decide to chunk it up like that?

Is there any rhyme or reason

Phil Pallen: I love this question because it’s proof that my approach isn’t necessarily applicable to absolutely everyone, and that’s what makes this landscape so beautiful. Isn’t it funny that we’ve been using Google for a decade and a half

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: and we know exactly what we need to do? We need to formulate, a question that’s going to get us an answer, and yet we can [00:17:00] open a chat bot or we can open, you know, we can open chat GBT and basically we don’t need a question.

We can say, um, actually the first thing that I’ll say in the chat is, here’s how I’d like to use this chat. all I say. And then it’ll, what, what I, it’ll summarize, okay, this is what we’re gonna do, and then it updates the name on the chat and I go back and rename that with the client code or an organization hierarchy so that I know how to quickly find it when I need it later.

There are chats that I’ve been using for over a year, um, and by doing that I can go to those and say, Hey, this doesn’t sound like Phil Palen,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: sound more like Phil Palen. And it knows exactly what I mean. answer your question, Connor, I’m more of a conversationalist, so, um, you’ll know this by chatting with me.

Yeah. I have lots of words, but I, I prefer to have a conversation. So it’s really, it’s really kind of reflective of my communication style and [00:18:00] I’d say most humans to say, Here’s what I’m thinking, or here’s what I want to do and I’d like to provide more information on that. Don’t take action yet.

’cause I wanna just get this thought out in the way that’s true how my brain works. So a lot of times I have my phone ready to go over here with chat GPT open and I’m working on the desktop typing things. And then I’ll open it up and I’ll just say, don’t take action yet. I wanna send you an audio note of some of my loose thoughts on this. And I’ve learned probably the most important rule with AI is like output is always contingent on input. So as much as it can save us time, you need to take the time to give as much info and context as humanly possible. So for me, that’s kind of like piecemeal, like in a conversation. We go back and forth and I learn and I think, and I land on ideas. I’ve kind of set up my workflow to [00:19:00] accommodate the way that I’m comfortable communicating, if that makes

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm. That’s, that’s awesome. So one of the things that I, I really want to have the audience really hone in on is that I think a lot of people think of AI as like, oh, it’ll help me write my emails or my social media posts. It’ll help me write stuff. But I love how you’re talking about, it’s d it’s data.

Like you can put so much data in it and get it to output all this stuff. Like even for my, the show, like I’m able to go and say, Hey, at che bt, go look at all the transcripts of the last five episodes of Phil’s. YouTube channel. Okay. Here’s, here’s the questions that I highlighted from the book that I read.

Because I do it on Kindle, it automatically goes to Notion, and I can take all that stuff and dump it in to chat GBT, and I say, I wanna ask Phil questions that most people don’t ask him before. So I’ll put some other interviews that you’ve done and it spits out, and I use deep research and it spits out this really long document that gives me these great crafted questions that are still me, because it knows my [00:20:00] tone of voice and all that stuff.

But I, I just think that people don’t understand how powerful that the analytical properties that you can throw in and all the data you can put in to chat GBT, they just think it’s a writer. So I just really like what you said. I’m gonna try, I have not tried that. Uh, you know, that, um, that slash um, what is it, dt Uh, do not, yeah, don’t take action.

I’m gonna try that next.

Phil Pallen: that, um, I wanna, before we lose this thought, I wanna, I wanna, I wanna um, just draw attention to something I have said. Almost every question that either of you have asked me, I have said that is such a good question. ’cause the truth is, the questions that you have asked me truly tailored to my brain and they are extensions of what I spent a year writing to me. In the guest seat here. I feel like you have, done your homework and made me feel very special as a guest because you’re not asking me [00:21:00] things that I’ve

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: That’s how I feel. Okay? And so that’s a compliment to both of you. I am really interested in this right now. How do we make people feel special?

How do we do our jobs better? And how can AI not be an indication of laziness, but instead a way that we are operate, we are able to operate in our true. Area of genius. And

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: love examples, so I’ll give a quick one. As a brand strategist, part of my task is to position a brand for success, build something to show for it, photography, brand, identity, website, and then create a social media strategy or a promotions strategy that can include content, social media, SEO, hand that off to my client for success, like, um, you know, um, um, what do you call it, um, on a bike when you’re learning how to bike those little wheels.

Jeff Sieh: Oh, training wheels. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Phil Pallen: Yeah, like training wheels. It’s Friday, it’s been a long week. I couldn’t remember training wheels, but [00:22:00] like I kind of, I’ve always thought of myself like that, like my job is to put the training wheels on and say, okay, now you’ve got everything you need to go be successful out there. I believe that AI has made me better at my job that I’ve been doing for 15 years. And I’ll, and I’ll give an example. You know, I will from the second we start working together and we have our first conversation. Everything is transcribed, uploaded into chat PT, um, on a teams plan, minimum two seats, $30 per seat, entry level subscription. That does not train the model on my data. Love chat, GPT and OpenAI, except for my concerns about privacy and compliance and security. Even though it doesn’t train the model on my information, because I pay $60 a month so that it doesn’t, I still don’t put confidential sensitive information in there. I just don’t trust it.

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: will quickly swipe over, upload A PDF that I [00:23:00] own, or that I have, and use, uh, Adobe Acrobat AI assistant, which does

Jeff Sieh: it’s amazing.

Phil Pallen: the model on your information. It’s that little rainbow button right in the corner of your, your Acrobat PDF. It is safe and secure, and it’s like $5 a month is like less than a Starbucks per month,

Jeff Sieh: Right?

Phil Pallen: is, in my opinion. safest way to interact with your own data and information. So I use a combination of the two point being four months into a project, a client project, I can say, Hey, hey, chat. Or hey AI assistant. Remember when that client told me this story about growing up and how it impacted their outlook, let’s go back and revisit that story and see how we can weave it into the about page copy

Jeff Sieh: Mm.

Phil Pallen: website. ai, I would’ve had to rely on my memory. Good fricking luck.

Jeff Sieh: Right, right.

Phil Pallen: now I feel in every aspect of my business, I’m like the conductor of the [00:24:00] orchestra. I don’t, I’m not, I’m not every, um, musician playing every instrument, but I am conducting this orchestra. Jeff, in the way that you described your podcast workflow that you’ve. Fine tuned and enjoyed the process of perfecting it.

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: that’s the joy and the opportunity, I think of the era we’re in right now.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah, and I wanna just be clear that I, I mean, I read your book and I highlighted stuff, so I’m not just like dumping data and just saying, Hey, find out who Phil is, and then just like going cold to this call. Like, I mean, you still have to do work and, and I know everybody wants to hit that easy button, but instead, you know, use it to enhance what you’re doing and, and write better questions and understand your customer more.

And don’t just think it’s an easy button because there’s gonna be a lot of that, you know, content vomit out there. And if you can stand out by being a better interviewer or a better show host or whatever, it’s gonna make a difference. So anyway, I just wanna make that clear. ’cause I don’t, I don’t want people to think like, oh, just throw it in there and it’ll spit out [00:25:00] whatever you want.

You always have to check and it’s always gotta be you and, and your voice. So I wanna bring some of our questions and comments from our amazing friends in the audience. Uh, Kira says, I love what Phil is saying. It’s a great research tool and also the writing AI does for us is only as good as what we provide for it.

And uh, magi said you had a better double chuck. You know, this is Dustin. And I know you mentioned him in his, in your book, uh, magi as well. This is one of the tools. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he says, better do double check. It’s not training new models. That setting, uh, sometimes switches itself back on, which, uh, as an AI developer, he would know for sure.

So, um, and then of course my friend cast ahead ’cause I know he does the same thing. He says, using LMS for guest prep on podcast improves everyone’s experience. Yeah. So thank you guys. Keep your questions and comments coming. I’ll try to bring it in as many as I can today. But I wanted to ask you, Phil, um, one of the, the questions from your book is like, you know, small businesses and this kind of goes into our data.

I. Analytical kind of thought right now is, you know, we, small businesses juggle, they have their social [00:26:00] posts, they’ve got ads, they’ve got emails. There’s a lot going on. So in AI for small business, in your book you describe how AI can even auto adjust ad campaigns on the fly, like dynamically tweaking budgets based on all these other, you know, click through rates and all this stuff.

So how can a tiny marketing team leverage that? For example, what task in marketing or advertising would you like automate with AI to let a small business kind of punch above its weight, so to say?

Phil Pallen: Yeah, there’s a few, there’s a few ways to do it. I’m generally a fan of any kind of tool that can bring like multiple platforms together. Funny enough, magi and Dustin leaving a comment is a perfect example of a, of a really powerful platform that, um, eliminates the need for you to have to go to chat GPT, and then Claude, and then Gemini, and then all the

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: test all of this. Magi brings everything into one dashboard and one console so that you can actually focus on. Actually learning and [00:27:00] testing and researching which tool is best for the task. For example, Gemini, I really like for anything that needs a strong citation. Like I’m, you know, even when you say to Chad, GPT, get me a citation, gimme five citations that are no older than two years, or no older than six months, it’s still not

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: Whereas Gemini’s really created by Google. So it’s

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: that. All of this, uh, you know, Claude is actually much better at creative writing than chat. CBT is, um, and Magi, all of this to say Magi is like the great tool that allows you to test all of these in one space without having to go hop from tool to tool. Um, I’m, I can’t remember, it’s been a few years since I made a video for that tool. So what is the name of that tool? I can’t remember. There’s 188 tools recommended in the book. So, and I’ve been creating YouTube videos for at least half of them

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: four years. I’ll remember it as soon as we’re not live,

Jeff Sieh: That’s, that’s why.

Phil Pallen: is a. That, that tool is a really great one. I have it on [00:28:00] Phil pal.co/tools. I’m fullscreen on Ecamm right now, so I’ll open it in a moment. That’s so I focus on this conversation and not get sidetracked by another tab. Um, but that’s another tool that basically gets you out of Facebook Ads Manager, which is my version of Hal.

And I know a lot of people agree. Um, it creates a really clean, uh, dashboard that brings in Facebook manager, brings in Google AdWords Manager and like just presents to you, um, in its own dashboard, the information that you only, the information that you need. So you’re responsible for providing the creative and it essentially uses AI to optimize and handle. Everything else, ah, that’s like a dream tool for

Jeff Sieh: right.

Phil Pallen: me that is not really a big fan of spreadsheets and

Jeff Sieh: Right?

Phil Pallen: Um, so that’s an example. Like basically Jeff like, uh, take inventory of the team and, and like, you know, what is it that you’re good at? It might be a [00:29:00] creative team. Like, um, you know, you get excited by creating, um, ad creative and someone like you is using Midy to create

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: images.

Before I forget, good job on the image of me, um,

Jeff Sieh: wasn’t mid journey, that was actually chat’s DPT today.

Phil Pallen: While I’m impressed, it was really fun. I was like, that actually looks like me. There’s a few extra wrinkles in the forehead,

Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

Phil Pallen: for a lot of Botox, so that that doesn’t happen in real

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: I still appreciated the realism.

Jeff Sieh: Good.

Phil Pallen: yeah, so, so I would say to answer the question seriously and stay on track.

Um. You know, kind of take inventory of the team. What are the strengths, what are the weaknesses? Like, if you want to focus on the creative, um, and, and, and AB testing that, then lean into that. Find a tool that helps you with the numbers and the, and the, the heavy lifting on that front. Vice versa. If the creative is your weakness, then lean in into tools.

Mid Journey, Dali, of course, I’m gonna say Adobe Firefly,

Jeff Sieh: Right,

Phil Pallen: um, the tool A among those that is safe for commercial [00:30:00] use. Doesn’t sound sexy, but when you’re a company, um, that could get, you know, sued for accidentally

Jeff Sieh: right.

Phil Pallen: the likeness of Spider-Man, that’s a problem.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah.

Phil Pallen: so I stick with Adobe Firefly where I can create images that are safe.

For commercial use, you can use structure reference if you want to tell the AI on how you want it to look or composition reference. Style reference says like, here are the colors, the textures, the style that I want you to follow. And I think we’re gonna see, they just came out with, um, Firefly version four and it’s a amazing with people and limbs and,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: detail. I feel like every single day these tools are getting better and better. Better. It’s a very exciting time.

Jeff Sieh: It is. It’s really, it’s really cool, especially just even if in one lane, like image creation, like, which I kind of really follow, it’s just, it’s so fast. Like it just moves every week.

Phil Pallen: It’s so fast.

Conor Brown: You say it all the time, this is the worst it’s ever gonna be,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: Yes.

Conor Brown: from here on, on every single thing. Phil, one thing I love about the [00:31:00] book is that you include prompts in it so that you can just

Phil Pallen: you.

Conor Brown: take it, put it into your LLM of, of, uh, record and go from there.

But I, I think the thing that really takes it over the top is when you can convey your brand, your, your personality, your voice to the LLM,

Phil Pallen: Mm-hmm.

Conor Brown: take that and put it in your own words.

Phil Pallen: Yes.

Conor Brown: way to do that? Verse just going months and months and months of, of back and forth. Hey, here’s my voice, here’s my brand.

I know people upload documents and stuff, but if someone’s just starting out and they want it to sound in their, like in their voice as quick as possible, what’s the best way to start with that?

Phil Pallen: I again, love this question. These are such good questions. Please, please be impressed by my ability to multitask. ’cause while you ask that question, I quickly, I quickly scan my tools page. The name of the tool for running your campaigns from one dashboard is called Otis. I[00:32:00]

Jeff Sieh: Mm.

Phil Pallen: for some reason always forget the name of

Jeff Sieh: Got it.

Phil Pallen: Um, maybe that’s branding. Maybe it’s my brain. So the best way to teach LLM how to sound like you. And by the way, it’s a very, very important first step, um, so that we don’t have delves and treasure troves and

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: your creativity. Unlock the potential and ash here and everywhere, like, By the way, love the revolt right now against, um, people saying, I used M dashes before Chad, GBT, they’ve ruined it, blah, blah, blah.

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: I actually welcome, embrace, and enjoy the friction because these are moments where humans are going, you know, we are human and I, I actually like

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: humans to stay in charge. So I like those. I think those moments are welcome. But so the, the way to do it, we know that ai, the best thing that it can do is compute a lot of information quickly.

So Connor, what I would do is I would sit here on a Friday for [00:33:00] about 10 minutes, timer on and go, let me grab a handful of different, um, existing pieces of content that are good illustrations of how I sound and what I say. So my brain immediately goes to. Call transcripts of strategy calls. So clients that are asking me advice or here’s another one, you go on a podcast interview, I’m doing it right now. I will record locally my answers to questions only mine. ’cause I, you know,

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: haven’t run an Adobe audition in the background. I can then take that transcript. Like you asking me good questions is helping me give good answers to things I’ve never said before. Things that are not even in the book because you guys have done so much research. I can take those and leave it in a little folder. Leave it in a little project folder. Or a PDF, uh, Phil’s thought leadership. So, so focused on the [00:34:00] things that already exist. Podcast transcripts, call transcripts, blog posts, Instagram caption, LinkedIn, text only posts. Pinterest pins, like, I mean, get creative here with like the things that you’ve created that look and sound like you over the years.

Ideally, any moment where you’ve shared your thought leadership, um, that should go into this kind of centralized repository. I’m actually working right now, um, pre preparing for a workshop that I’m gonna teach for Creative Mornings, um, I think sometime in June or July. And it’s basically doing this in the form of A PDF.

I’m kind of calling it a create a custom GPT, no code required, like non-tech.

Jeff Sieh: Oh, cool.

Phil Pallen: essentially create a PDF up to 600 pages with a few pages. I’m designing the framework right now, but Connor, I’m thinking like first two pages would be, answer these five questions that, um, us an opportunity to hear and define your brand voice. [00:35:00] Um. Um, so that’s what I’m working on now, so stay tuned. But I’m kind of creating that framework in a, in a no tech way to basically hand over to someone and say, just fill in the blanks and add a few pages of examples that I define, and you’re off to the races. You just, you need to have that kind of information to juice it, squeeze it, get what you need out of it

Conor Brown: Nice.

Jeff Sieh: so awesome. One of the things that, um, you know, we have a lot of creators in the audience who, you know, have a podcast or do YouTube videos or whatever, and I think what you just said is so key because there’s so much content that we have already done that is not tapped into. Like, I, I just went and uploaded, uh, a year and a half, half of my transcripts and it’s so funny because like two years ago I couldn’t even put an hour’s worth of a transcript in there.

I’d have to chop it up and like, you know, try to do these workarounds with Chet GBT. And now you can put in like a year and a half of an hour long. I don’t even how many hours that is. But say I even ask it like, what products can I make from this? Or what [00:36:00] can, can I write a book based on this? Gimme some ideas.

And the amount of, the way it was able to distill that. So I really encourage anybody who’s been doing that for a while is go grab those transcripts, throw them in Jet, GBT, and just start asking questions. Like, there’s so many cool things you can learn about your company, yourself, your audience. By doing that.

It’s, it’s just phenomenal. So I wanna get into some, uh, questions. Uh, ’cause you mentioned chat, GPI mean, uh, some custom GBTs and Keira has a great question. She goes, would you have any advice for those wanting to create a custom GPT to sell that is geared towards supporting a specific target audience or industry?

Do you have any advice for Kira?

Phil Pallen: Yes.

Jeff Sieh: Cool.

Phil Pallen: uh, one of my, my business besties recently did this. I haven’t done this. I’ve wanted to do it, but I suppose I haven’t just, uh, I haven’t put it. High enough on my to-do list to actually take action on it. But my friend Becca Harpa, brand is inside the square, she’s the the reigning [00:37:00] queen of, and it’s very niche, Squarespace, CSS tutorials.

Jeff Sieh: Wow.

Phil Pallen: took all of her knowledge, blog posts, video transcripts, code snippets, and created a product from that and was wildly successful with her launch, one of her best launches, maybe her best launch in her entire business, um, uh, um, career. And it’s because she had an audience of people that already, uh, know, like, and trust her, and people that responded very well to like basically having that 24 7 resource where you can go and get a taste of Becca’s knowledge. And, and brand voice also. And personality, right? It’s not just knowledge, it’s paired with personality that keeps us coming back to you for more. So my advice would be, try not to get lost in the technical weeds of this. The task at hand is how do I bring all of this information together? The more [00:38:00] information you bring, the better the output.

So the better the input, the better the output. And so be really focused instead of on like, what fancy tech tool can I code and, and, and work for this? Be more focused on like. How can I make sure, how can I gather the information I need to make this a, a, a good GPT? How can I centralize this and what else do I need to provide and how, you know, test it. Um, there are so many ways that you can do this. You can use a custom, um, um, open ai, um, um, like customize it on the

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: create your own GPT. They make that very easy. I’ve taught you today how to do it for $5 a month with, um, Adobe Acrobat AI assistant. The difference being like if there’s any kind of sensitive information potentially in what you’re providing, I would never put that into chat sheet.

Bt I just don’t trust it. So what I would do instead is [00:39:00] I would open it in Adobe Acrobat, click the rainbow button in the corner, and then the difference is. When you get an output in Acrobat, it gives you a citation that you can click and it will take you to the specific spot of where it extracted it.

So just think about like the right solution for you. If you’re not a technical person, then keep it non-technical. Deliver it in the form of A PDF or deliver it in the form of a chat, GPT, um, um, custom GPT that you can share and sell access to. Um. You don’t need it to be super advanced. If you wanna make it technical, you can. Um, I’m actually not a very technical person, and so, uh, many of my solutions are based on, um, paid tools that have a, a, a friendly UI for a busy, productive person like me. I have other friends like my friend Mike Russell, who I,

Jeff Sieh: Oh yeah, he’s great.

Phil Pallen: few days ago. Yeah, he and I, uh, and, and his wife Isabella.

We talk every month and catch up on all of our [00:40:00] nerdiness. And Mike is always steps ahead of me on what he’s like coding and customizing and zapping together. Um, but that’s him, that’s his curiosity and his,

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: kind of level of comfort and challenge for himself. So, yeah, there’s, there’s so many ways of doing it Now, try not to get overwhelmed by the tech would be my short answer.

Jeff Sieh: Awesome.

Conor Brown: That is awesome. And we have a great question here. Uh, perfect for Dustin or, uh, perfect from Dustin to, for Phil, the Adobe guy of course, and Dustin for Magi says, have you looked at Adobe’s privacy data training policy? He hasn’t, but he heard it might be pretty invasive. Can you comment on that, Phil? I know you talk about, you know, uh, uh, that’s your go-to for a number of reasons for privacy and

Phil Pallen: Yeah.

Conor Brown: makes Adobe different than the other LLMs out there from an AI perspective and privacy?

Phil Pallen: Sure. So I should clarify it off the bat. I’m not an employee. I don’t [00:41:00] work for Adobe. I work with Adobe. I’m contracted to work on projects. Certainly you may have heard in the news, of course, Adobe and any of these kind of like early to market or like leading tech, uh, tech platforms, any kind of, I would say misstep or alleged misstep makes the news because there’s a lot of negativity towards ai. Understandably, people are scared, people are upset. Um, I. I think what made the news a few months ago was something in the terms and conditions, which truly was a misunderstanding. It’s actually not invasive of all the AI tools and, and companies. Adobe airs more on the side of safety than the others, so it does not train on your data.

It doesn’t own your data. If that’s something that you’re concerned about, Adobe is one of the tools that I would recommend using

Jeff Sieh: Hmm. That’s great. Yeah, I think things are, I, I mean, so we’ve been talking about kind of the here and now, and I wanna look now to kind [00:42:00] of the future because we’ve mentioned that AI is evolving at this crazy, I, I’ve never seen something move at this fast, ever, even with personal computers, when. ’cause I, ’cause I’m old, uh, I remember when personal computers came out and the, you know, the Commodore Vic 20 and then, you know, I mean all this stuff and it still took a while to get in the schools, but this stuff is just moving and changing so fast ’cause of the internet and all this stuff.

But I wanna talk about strategy for keeping up with everything. ’cause in your book, you don’t just list tools. You also emphasize building a comprehensive AI strategy for the long run. So as an AI strategist and, and keynote speaker, ’cause I, you know, I’ve heard you speak so well at EAMS creator camp. You got kind of a front row seat to what’s coming next.

So let’s talk about future proofing and where AI is headed for small business. So like, if a small business wants to kind of. Fufu, I can’t even speak. Future proof itself. Where should they start? You know, in your book you urge owners to like take that time to [00:43:00] develop an AI plan. So what should we, what should they do?

Like, how can they figure out where to go and what will make the most impact on their workflows? I,

Phil Pallen: Yeah, I always, I’m a big fan of like giving a structure and saying, Hey, start with this, but then customize it for your, for your own business or for your own workflow. I think you also did that in your, your example of how you do your podcast guest or episode research. Like this is what’s so cool about this.

We’re all kind of saying, Hey, here’s this cool thing I figured out. Um, if this is helpful for you, great. Use it. Um, but you then might have ideas that you can share that I learned from. That’s the space we’re in and I find it really, really exciting. So even pre ai, I’ve always been a big fan of like creating a framework or like a three step

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: Here’s how we can start to think about this when I’m building a brand position, build. Then promote stick over sale, sign out front of the house like that. That kind of process I follow or teach is also indicative [00:44:00] of like the process, the journey that I take my clients on. So my advice. Looking forward is surround yourself with smart people that have the time and the bandwidth to continue learning on your behalf.

What I mean by that, typically a lot of creators, I mean, you guys are a great example. I mentioned Mike Russell has his YouTube channel, um,

Jeff Sieh: That’s so good.

Phil Pallen: great example. I, in my own way, have my own lane. You won’t find me talking about super technical tools, but you will find me reviewing and recommending AI tools and platforms because that’s my job. That’s become my job. So three years ago, four years ago, a hundred percent of my income was client services, creative, you know, branding website lo. Now that is, I calculated yesterday, first quarter of the year, 20% of my business is client work and the rest is made up in now. Content creation,

Jeff Sieh: Mm.

Phil Pallen: So yes, of course I’m getting paid by the [00:45:00] brands for the tools that I’m reviewing, but I’ve been doing this for four years, and so you can expect someone like me, like a pilot. I have accrued a lot of hours

Jeff Sieh: Right, right.

Phil Pallen: I make a recommendation and when I review a tool and I, and I say, this is great, and this could be better, you know, consider it and, and ideally, you surround yourself with a handful of people that can help you stay informed without it overtaking your day or derailing your afternoon.

One of the most important things for small business owners, which is my target audience, is to keep your eye on the prize, which is not learning about the latest AI chip technology for the afternoon. It’s focusing. the things that I outlined earlier on, where do you make high impact? What do you enjoy doing?

What do you not enjoy doing? Or what are the things that you know that you’re doing that are not high impact? Get them [00:46:00] off your to-do list and hand them over somewhere else. Like it is way more important for you to be focused on those three things than it is for you to spend the afternoon trying and testing and signing up for free trials of

Jeff Sieh: Right, right.

Phil Pallen: So surround yourself with smart people and creators you trust to help guide you along the way. That would be my recommendation. And try very hard not to get distracted and derailed by all the shiny objects that exist right now.

Jeff Sieh: That’s great advice, especially for fall small business owners. Yeah, really good.

Conor Brown: Shiny object syndrome is real. It’s, it’s real. And,

Phil Pallen: It’s real.

Conor Brown: more you can, you know, neglect it and not let it feed into you, the better. We’ve talked a lot, Phil, about how most impactful way to use AI is when it can talk like us, when it can use our style, when it

Phil Pallen: Yes.

Conor Brown: or customers, because it’s acting more like us.

Right? And that’s great, but there’s a fear that it could also replace the human [00:47:00] touch, right? Which we

Phil Pallen: Yeah,

Conor Brown: want to happen. It’s still crucial that with small businesses we have that human touch. So as AI gets more powerful, as it gets more Ubiquiti ubiquitous, and we’re using it more and more in our day-to-day business plans, how do you see solopreneurs, entrepreneurs, small businesses, able to keep that personal and human connection with their customers?

Phil Pallen: some. It’s a, it’s again, a great question. I know I should stop saying that, but when the questions are so good, I am forced to compliment you. I always go back to like kind of pre ai uh, thinking. For me it’s always been lean into personality. Your brand is gonna be successful online because it looks and feels and sounds like you. That’s what I’ve been saying since I started. ’cause I feel I have such a strong conviction, um, that that is the truth. Whether it be in my own experience, growing my own brand and building a business that [00:48:00] really fulfills me. But then also doing this for 400 clients since, which I have, since I started. So, um, I even wonder, I’ve been thinking this week, like I wonder if branding is less important, uh, than it used to be two or three years ago.

And what I mean by that is like having a, a picture perfect, well executed, you know, squeaky clean visual brand that everyone on the team follows. I think it’s important for a corporation for a personal brand, like aren’t we kind of in an era where we like mistakes ’cause they remind us that a human wrote

Jeff Sieh: Hmm.

Phil Pallen: or created it versus something quickly AI generated that looks or could be perceived as lazy.

We’ve talked about that. So it’s just like something I’m marinating on. I always like to. Give the disclaimer that I, I don’t necessarily have all the answers on the topic, but I’m certainly curious to explore them and have discussions about it. I don’t necessarily know what the future holds, but certainly [00:49:00] I think that it’s, it’s, um, it’s really underscoring the need for human, and I love these reminders, uh, uh, on when and why AI can’t replace humans.

Jeff Sieh: Hmm.

Phil Pallen: it can, it can never, uh, draw on human experience in the way that we can from lived to human experience. It’s not as good at storytelling, even when you provide lots of input. It doesn’t come anywhere close to what a human is able to generate creatively. Um, Those are the types of things that I think about and, and I, and I, I welcome and love the friction and the reminders of how important the human is in the equation.

Last example, we can use an AI tool to create a logo in four steps. Does that replace the work that I am able to do thoughtfully over the course of four months after listening to someone’s business goals, exploring different directions visually, that capture a [00:50:00] client, um, you know, in a way, in a brand that they can use for the rest of the, you know, the lifetime of their business?

No, it can’t do that. And so I’m not really worried. I, I, I, I, I don’t, I’m not worried about being replaced by AI

Jeff Sieh: Mm.

Phil Pallen: can do my job better, but we

Jeff Sieh: Right?

Phil Pallen: pause and go, huh? How do we make sure. We are well positioned, even with some slight tweaks

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: make sure that our business revolves around the human component that AI can’t replace. is hugely important that we constantly think about that so that we are secure in our businesses and in our positioning.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah. So this last question, this last kind of thought, ’cause I’m really interested to know what you think about this, Phil. So, um, I’ve been, you know, I’m in the podcasting creator, video creator community, and, and we talk a lot. And one of the things that I have seen just in the last year. It’s like tools, like script has [00:51:00] changed my, we have a vertical where we, we do editing and podcast production for, you know, clients.

And I’ve seen the way that I used to, I mean, I grew up on Adobe version two or something, I don’t know. But I mean, like, it’s changed the way I edit, like completely like, ’cause it’s all text-based, now I can do it into a script. Um, and then even like this week, the, one of the, the CEOs of Apple said that, um, search is dying like search engine.

You know, finding your business through Google is kind of changing. The whole layout is changing because of ai. So what are your thoughts on that? ’cause you know, some, some businesses are gonna change completely. Like, I think editing the people who are editing videos, it’s eventually gonna just have conversations with it and it’s gonna do it for them.

So that goes, okay. Do editors need to still have. Like, will I pay for an editor or will I pay for a program? I mean, there’s all these questions. I mean, uh, Chris Stone and I had an, uh, a talk about it and he was thinking that, you know, there’s always gonna be, have to be [00:52:00] a storyteller behind it, which I agree.

But what are your thoughts about this so fast of a shift, uh, about businesses keeping up? Like a lot of people, their top of funnel is Google and that’s, that could go away. Um, so what are your thoughts on how, in this kinda we’re talking about future proofing, what can businesses do?

Phil Pallen: Yeah, it’s a big question. So let me give you some, some, some initial ideas on this. I think it’s scary ’cause it’s change. So rightfully people are concerned or scared or anxious, I always validate any of those responses to anything related to ai ’cause they are valid responses. Um, even if it’s not

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: in my business, that doesn’t mean that it’s valid for someone else.

So, SEO for example, you mentioned search is dramatically changing, but I’ve talked to experts, I’ve talked to friends that do that for a living and they say, well, I. It’s changing, but the mechanics are similar. So you go through the process of [00:53:00] building thought leadership to show up in Google in very similar ways, um, to, to being able to show up in tool, you know, in in, in tools like Chachi pt, it’s a similar process.

There’s gonna be slight differences that we’re all learning as we do. Um, but process of, for example, of building thought leadership or relevancy is still the same. So don’t you know. be concerned, but don’t freak out

Jeff Sieh: Right.

Phil Pallen: chances are the things that you need to do to show up in Google are still very similar to the things that you need to be doing to show up and get recommended in chat.

CPTI would say stay curious. Continue to soak up information and recommendations from experts that are drawing on their experience. Wins from clients, wins from their own, you know, brands or portfolios. Um, that’s, at least that’s what I’m doing. I’m, I’m, I’m kind of, I know someone, for example, who specializes in SEO is doing this day to day in the way that I’m doing branding and content [00:54:00] creation day to day. There’s still so much to learn as it so quickly evolves, which you’ve highlighted that. I think, yes, the mediums and the platforms are gonna change, but the mechanics still stay, um, relatively the same. And so, um, don’t worry too much. I’m an optimist though.

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm. Right. Yeah.

Phil Pallen: I give.

Jeff Sieh: That’s great, and we, we, once again, we’ve got so many great comments. You know, Kira says, I used to use Sony Vegas and Premier all the time, and even, they’re so powerful. AI tools. AI tools are so much more efficient in our process now. And then Gary says it all, he goes, fascinating talk today, guys.

Phil, I could keep going for another two hours because you’re just, uh, the guy to talk to. You’re very easy to understand. Uh, you’re just, you’re awesome. I just thank you so much. Come on this show. But I want to give people a chance where they can find you, get your book, all the things that is Phil Palin, tell people where they can find you.

Phil Pallen: Sure. [00:55:00] So yeah, we published this in January. Um, people say, Phil, how did you write a book on AI on a topic that’s constantly a changing in the way that Connor already highlighted it? I focused on the aspects on the topic that are really as evergreen as possible. So the book goes through every aspect of business as highlighted on the cover.

The ones where I, you know, have been working for 15 years, marketing, I. Owning my business operations and logistics sales, like those are things that I’ve, I’ve been doing just by nature of owning a business, but also topics that I didn’t know as well, like data analysis and security. I didn’t know anything about that.

So writing the book was such a great opportunity to also learn and share what I’ve learned over the years combined with tool recommendations. That’s pretty evergreen, although there has been obviously some changes. Some of these AI companies just disappear, but many of them, you know, when I’m recommending them, they’re tools that I’ve either tried myself. Or I’ve thoroughly researched and

Jeff Sieh: Hmm.

Phil Pallen: almost, I think, or more than 200 of them, um, in the book when you [00:56:00] add them all up. And then stories owning a branding agency has really given me a window into so many different industries and types of jobs that throughout the book, I use real and hypothetical examples of my actual clients across as many industries as I could come up with.

So that’s what the book is about. Um, in addition to the book, I create content, uh, one to two videos a week on YouTube, and then Instagram. I’m often just kind of, I travel a lot and keep busy with all kinds of exciting things, and I keep people up to date on Instagram, and then I’m happy to connect on LinkedIn as well.

Those are probably the three platforms that I spend the most time. If you took the time to hang out with us today, please, let’s connect LinkedIn, Instagram, et cetera. And, uh, we really appreciate your time. There’s a lot of places you could be, but the fact that you’re hanging out with us today on a Friday means the world.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah, it’s, we have the best audience around. Oh, and, and real quick, I gotta ask this guy. I know Gary, it’s really important to him, but, uh, what, what camera and lens are you using? For that dreamy bouquet. Okay?

Phil Pallen: well thank [00:57:00] you. This is a Sony ZV. Is it a ZVE 10 or it’s like the pretty standard one for, for live Streaming. And then I have a Sigma lens that was a couple hundred dollars, but that’s, I think what creates the effect, not the camera.

Jeff Sieh: Mm-hmm.

Phil Pallen: Um, this is the one that sits over my desk. My office is actually really small.

It looks way bigger on camera. It’s an illusion. Um, so this camera I use for my like Streaming or podcast interviews. You see it auto focusing. And then I use, um, a Sony, um, a three, a seven, three, uh, for my YouTube videos that’s hooked up over here behind a prompter. Um, and so I use just, those are the two that I have.

Jeff Sieh: Awesome. Thank you for that. And where can we find out more about the amazing Unsinkable Connor Brown?

Conor Brown: Vacation kingdoms.com. Of course, at Vacation Kingdoms over on Instagram and my new Instagram handle at theme park. Happy hour. I’m drinking around the theme Parks of Orlando. Check

Phil Pallen: Oh, I’m gonna join you next time.

Conor Brown: awesome, [00:58:00] awesome, fantastic show today.

Jeff Sieh: Yeah. Thank you guys. And by the way, I would love for you guys if you want to, uh, keep up to date on all our guests and the show’s coming up, go to jeff c.com/news signup for the newsletter. We have fun in our email community. So go check that out. Um, it’s totally free. Jeff c.com/news. Thanks again for our amazing sponsors, Ecamm, find out more about them at Ecamm dot com slash jeff save, uh, 15% by using Jeff 15 on checkout.

And with that, thank you guys so much. This was an amazing show, Phil, thank you so much for coming on. We gotta do this again. I still wanna do the Midjourney Firefly dual sometime together. That would be so much fun. And with that, everybody. Yeah. Right. We’ll do that. So everybody, thank you so much. We’ll see you guys next time.

Have a great weekend, everybody. Bye now.